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> I don't think this is cut and dry. Either consciousness is some sort of a a metaphysical process we haven't figured out (or simply won't be able to), or our

> I don't think this is cut and dry. Either consciousness is some sort of a a metaphysical process we haven't figured out (or simply won't be able to), or our minds are clearly part of the universe. You can do things to the brain, such as anesthesia during surgery, and consciousness goes away. That particular space in the universe that is inside our skulls is conscious (and thus is a point and space in time) means the universe is conscious on some level. How can it possibly be argued otherwise, it's not like brain isn't in this universe? Unless we want to decouple consciousness from brains, but that gets back to the anesthesia example. > haven't seen outside. There is no outside. Einstein showed with general relativity that space and time are connected. No space, no time. And certainly no concept of "outside".

jstanley 5y ago
The point about anaesthesia is a really good one, I hadn't considered that -- if the mind were outside the brain then the most that anaesthetic could do is sensory deprivation rather than loss of consciousness. > There is no outside. This is unknowable. To take my example from the other comment: there is nothing within the Doom video game universe to indicate that there is a real universe outside. You can go as far as you want in X, Y, or Z and you'll never break out of Doom and find yourself in real life. But that doesn't mean there is no outside: the mind controlling the player is outside the Doom universe. (But anaesthetic can't work within the Doom universe, because the anesthetic has no way to reach the mind.)