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> Because it's being used to drive wages down and American workers are getting fired from their jobs. America controls something like 80% of the world software

by paulgb 5y ago

> Because it's being used to drive wages down and American workers are getting fired from their jobs. America controls something like 80% of the world software market (depending how you measure it) with ~5% of the population. I’m very skeptical that this would remain true if domestic companies were restricted from hiring the top talent in the world. There are arguments for and against immigration (full disclosure, I’m an immigrant), but the “steal our jobs” rhetoric is based on the false counterfactual that you could get rid of immigrants but keep their jobs.

axiolite 5y ago
> the “steal our jobs” rhetoric is based on the false counterfactual I didn't say "steal", but it's absolutely happening all the time: "Information technology workers at Southern California Edison (SCE) are being laid off and replaced by workers from India. Some employees are training their H-1B visa holding replacements, and many have already lost their jobs." https://www.computerworld.com/article/2879083/southern-california-edison-it-workers-beyond-furious-over-h-1b-replacements.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/2879083/southern-calif...
- paulgb 5y ago
  Sure, but my point is that cases like this are possible for the same reason that the US is able to own 80% of the software market. You can’t expect to have one without the other.
  - commandlinefan 5y ago
    > the US is able to own 80% of the software market. So what you’re saying is that H1B visa abuse allows the small handful of people who own massive software companies to benefit at the expense of the citizenry of the United States?
- belltaco 5y ago
  Cost cutting is good when it happens in other industries and helps software engineers by driving down costs, like tech hardware. But once it comes to their own, suddenly 100 to 400K salaries are not enough. >The unemployment rate for tech occupations dropped to 1.5% in July, according to the "Employment Situation" report released today by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) reveals. (#JobsReport). That's the lowest level since August 2019 and is close to the historic low of 1.3%. Aug 6, 2021
VictorPath 5y ago
> hiring the top talent in the world This is the wording of H1b visas as well - hiring for talent with special skills that can't be found by workers in the US. Studies by Norm Matloff detail, and anyone with experience with Cognizant coders know that these are not visas which are only going to "top talent". It is going to imported coolies in order to undermine wages, and have a captive workforce tied to the company, effectively unable to leave.

by paulgb 5y ago

axiolite 5y ago

> the “steal our jobs” rhetoric is based on the false counterfactual I didn't say "steal", but it's absolutely happening all the time: "Information technology workers at Southern California Edison (SCE) are being laid off and replaced by workers from India. Some employees are training their H-1B visa holding replacements, and many have already lost their jobs." https://www.computerworld.com/article/2879083/southern-california-edison-it-workers-beyond-furious-over-h-1b-replacements.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/2879083/southern-calif...

paulgb 5y ago
Sure, but my point is that cases like this are possible for the same reason that the US is able to own 80% of the software market. You can’t expect to have one without the other.
- commandlinefan 5y ago
  > the US is able to own 80% of the software market. So what you’re saying is that H1B visa abuse allows the small handful of people who own massive software companies to benefit at the expense of the citizenry of the United States?
belltaco 5y ago
Cost cutting is good when it happens in other industries and helps software engineers by driving down costs, like tech hardware. But once it comes to their own, suddenly 100 to 400K salaries are not enough. >The unemployment rate for tech occupations dropped to 1.5% in July, according to the "Employment Situation" report released today by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) reveals. (#JobsReport). That's the lowest level since August 2019 and is close to the historic low of 1.3%. Aug 6, 2021

VictorPath 5y ago

> hiring the top talent in the world This is the wording of H1b visas as well - hiring for talent with special skills that can't be found by workers in the US. Studies by Norm Matloff detail, and anyone with experience with Cognizant coders know that these are not visas which are only going to "top talent". It is going to imported coolies in order to undermine wages, and have a captive workforce tied to the company, effectively unable to leave.