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Great paper! Things that stood while skimming: - Bidirectional DNS poisoning: China can send forged DNS responses if you try to access certain Chinese domains

Great paper! Things that stood while skimming: - Bidirectional DNS poisoning: China can send forged DNS responses if you try to access certain Chinese domains from outside the GFW. This isn't server-side enforced geoblocking. - GFW uses a small space of forged IPs, some belonging to Facebook, Twitter, Dropbox which may be responsible for a non-negligible overhead in server costs responding to HTTP requests for irrelevant hostnames. Can FB sue China in court for damages for the cost of serving these forged requests?

seniorivn 5y ago
you do realize that a concept of a court is completely country specific? what court do you mean?
- Dah00n 5y ago
  Courts in China works just as well/bad as in, say, the US. A specific name doesn't change that.
  - seniorivn 5y ago
    i mean that china isn't an entity that you could sue, any foreign court has no power over china, and suing chineese government in chineese court is a joke(much more than doing the same in us, by the way)
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      Suing the US government in a US court is only possible insofar as the US government agrees to be sued. It's the principle of sovereign immunity.
sticnarf 5y ago
Packets from the China mainland to these forged IPs are routed to blackhole at the international network outlet of China. So, normally there is no overhead for sites like Facebook.
BiteCode_dev 5y ago
> Can FB sue China in court for damages for the cost of serving these forged requests? Sure they can. They can't win, but they can waste time and money.
killingtime74 5y ago
No they cannot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_immunity https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_immunity. They had to pass a special law to allow the 9/11 families to sue https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice_Against_Sponsors_of_Terrorism_Act https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice_Against_Sponsors_of_...
- HideousKojima 5y ago
  Sovereign Immunity would only apply to attempts to sue China in a Chinese court, other courts in other nations may well side with Facebook. Of course these other courts would have limited means to enforce their rulings.
  - killingtime74 5y ago
    No, it applies in foreign courts as well. That’s why the 9/11 families needed that US law, they didn’t sue in Saudi they sued in New York
mrjin 5y ago
Nope. For 2nd item, I don't see a reason why GFW would do that. I did see some domain names resolved to 0.0.0.0 or 127.0.0.1 which is nice and easy and unlikely going to cause a problem. And in most of cases, the host names were actually correctly resolved but the request either timed out or got a connection reset error etc. as such methods are the cheapest way to block accesses at scale.

seniorivn 5y ago

you do realize that a concept of a court is completely country specific? what court do you mean?

Dah00n 5y ago
Courts in China works just as well/bad as in, say, the US. A specific name doesn't change that.
- seniorivn 5y ago
  i mean that china isn't an entity that you could sue, any foreign court has no power over china, and suing chineese government in chineese court is a joke(much more than doing the same in us, by the way)
  - sudosysgen 5y ago
    Suing the US government in a US court is only possible insofar as the US government agrees to be sued. It's the principle of sovereign immunity.

sticnarf 5y ago

Packets from the China mainland to these forged IPs are routed to blackhole at the international network outlet of China. So, normally there is no overhead for sites like Facebook.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago

> Can FB sue China in court for damages for the cost of serving these forged requests? Sure they can. They can't win, but they can waste time and money.

killingtime74 5y ago

No they cannot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_immunity https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_immunity. They had to pass a special law to allow the 9/11 families to sue https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice_Against_Sponsors_of_Terrorism_Act https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice_Against_Sponsors_of_...

HideousKojima 5y ago
Sovereign Immunity would only apply to attempts to sue China in a Chinese court, other courts in other nations may well side with Facebook. Of course these other courts would have limited means to enforce their rulings.
- killingtime74 5y ago
  No, it applies in foreign courts as well. That’s why the 9/11 families needed that US law, they didn’t sue in Saudi they sued in New York

mrjin 5y ago

Nope. For 2nd item, I don't see a reason why GFW would do that. I did see some domain names resolved to 0.0.0.0 or 127.0.0.1 which is nice and easy and unlikely going to cause a problem. And in most of cases, the host names were actually correctly resolved but the request either timed out or got a connection reset error etc. as such methods are the cheapest way to block accesses at scale.