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Trains go from a place you don’t want to leave from to another place you don’t want to go at a time you don’t want to leave. Now imagine instead of rails, we bu
by NoblePublius 5y ago
Trains go from a place you don’t want to leave from to another place you don’t want to go at a time you don’t want to leave. Now imagine instead of rails, we built roads (much cheaper) only for autopilot vehicles (including busses or whatever proletarian fantasy you prefer). You’re welcome.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- andbberger 5y agopeople just love to hate trains
- sofixa 5y agoOr they're built with some sense and actually cover the population's needs. I wonder how it is that trains are so successful across Europe and Asia, but are a proletarian fantasy that couldn't possibly work in the US.
- djbebs 5y agoTrains aren't sucessful in europe. They are a massive drain of resources that survive primarily as a result of subsidies and government policy. The US ironically has a much more efficient and sustainable train network, it's just that the thing trains are really efficient at is cargo, not personal transportation.
- andbberger 5y agoRoads aren't sucessful in the US. They are a massive drain of resources that survive primarily as a result of subsidies and government policy.
- goos 5y agoAre you implying that being successful and receiving subsidies are mutually exclusive? In which case the petroleum industry would like to have a word with you. Much like with healthcare, European countries (generally) tend to think that it's decent idea to spend government resources to provide value to their citizen. Having regularly commuted using trains in Europe for a decade and a half, I would argue they are a pretty great, comfortable mode of transportation – and I can feel slightly more at ease knowing I'm not contributing as much to our carbon emissions.
- sofixa 5y agoHave you actually been in any European country? Trains are heavily used for short, medium and long distance travel. High-speed rail in Western Europe is huge. Many many people commute via train or subway. Profitability has absolutely nothing to do with it. High speed rail in France is hugely profitable, but the state subsides many lines because it's the right thing to do. Railways have a higher capacity, are much cleaner and faster, and are provided as a common service. You don't expect the fire department or forest service to be profitable, do you?
- NoblePublius 5y agoRyanAir is generally cheaper
- sofixa 5y agoBut often requires you to travel a few hours to a faraway airport. It has its place and is cheaper and faster on specific combos ( e.g. Barcelona to Warsaw), but trains are usually faster/more pleasant/cheaper and always cleaner.
- djbebs 5y agoI have lived in europe all my life, and have extensive experience with both trains and other forms of public transportation in several European countries.
- estaseuropano 5y agoYou are missing the obvious point that infrastructure is a main use of taxes. Do you think roads are profitable? Rail (& other public transport) has many other benefits, e.g. you'll need less policing and maintenance of roads if they are less used; air pollution from fossil fuels and tire wear are reduced, stress and accidents are reduced thereby decreasing healthcare costs, etc. It all is a matter of building up the proper network, rather than to give more subsidies to big oil and the car industries (see the eternally repeating bailouts).
- xx511134bz 5y agoRoad costs are astonishing. I remember seeing a single traffic light arm cost $250k.
- NoblePublius 5y agoIt took 400 days to construct the Golden Gate Bridge in 1933. It took six years to build a new offramp for it in 2000.
- NoblePublius 5y agoThe Federal government in the United States does not require tax revenue to fund road construction. The only tax actually earmarked for this purpose is the gasoline tax, which is less than 2% of the Federal government’s appropriations for highway construction. Federal taxes are largely punitive and coercive (we want you to do this thing like have children, or live here, or not get too rich doing that thing because otherwise Lockheed lobbyists get upset).
- jazzyjackson 5y agoAll I had to do was google “Are roads fully funded by the gas tax” to find a contracticting source: > Nearly as much of the cost of building and maintaining highways now comes from general taxes such as income and sales taxes (plus additional federal debt) as comes from gasoline taxes or other “user fees” on drivers. General taxes accounted for $69 billion of highway spending in 2012. [pdf] https://uspirg.org/sites/pirg/files/reports/Who%20Pays%20for%20Roads%20vUS.pdf https://uspirg.org/sites/pirg/files/reports/Who%20Pays%20for...
- rsynnott 5y agoHello, Elon. (Musk has a bit of a train phobia)