7 ms·

Hibernation in Windows hasn't gone anywhere. I have a Dell laptop in front of me and it has hibernate in the start menu as normal. Problem is that hibernation

by zokier 5y ago

Hibernation in Windows hasn't gone anywhere. I have a Dell laptop in front of me and it has hibernate in the start menu as normal. Problem is that hibernation is slooow so people don't like to use it

thaumasiotes 5y ago
I have a Dell laptop I bought within the last couple of months. Hibernate is not in the start menu, and the option to add it to the start menu has been disabled. It's still possible to assign "hibernate" as the action taken in response to various power-related actions such as closing the lid or pressing the power button. This makes no sense; I'm not sure what's going on.
- RGamma 5y ago
  You can enable the start menu hibernate button in advanced power settings: System -> Power & sleep -> Additional power settings -> Choose what the power buttons do -> Change settings that are currently unavailable -> Check Hibernate. And then get lucky that your laptop wakes up again (mine dies 1 out of 10 times) Edit: sorry, can't read.
  - thaumasiotes 5y ago
    No, you can't; that option is disabled. It cannot be checked. I don't know how I can state this more clearly. "Turn on fast startup (recommended)" is checked, and that option is also disabled and can't be unchecked, despite obviously being undesirable.
    - lozenge 5y ago
      Maybe you have Group Policy settings? Sometimes "Windows tweaker" type apps install these. Also, mine has a link "Change settings that are currently unavailable" which shows a UAC prompt and then enables all checkboxes.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - frosted-flakes 5y ago
      The checkbox is disabled by default. To enable it you have to click the "Allow advanced options" button at the top of the page.
y4mi 5y ago
Why though? My drive can write with up to 3gb/s. I only have 32 gb of ram, so the process should take at most 10s. Generally less, as a lot is usually free.
- sprayk 5y ago
  you have 32 GiB of RAM, gibibytes, meaning 32 * 1024^3. does your drive write at 3 GB/s (gigabytes) or Gb/s (gigabits)? if little b bits, it'll be more like 80 sec
  - vladvasiliu 5y ago
    Probably "big b". 3 Gb/s (small b) is approximately 350 MB/s (big b). My 9-year-old SATA SSD does better than that.
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  - y4mi 5y ago
    if this comment is serious i strongly suggest you inform yourself about nvme drives. they're absolutely worth their money. i haven't encountered anyone in years that didn't have at least one in their pc/laptop, but if you dont: i strongly suggest you buy one. because writing 30 Gbyte sequentially generally does takes about 10 seconds.
    - vbezhenar 5y ago
      When I got my work laptop, first thing I did is erased its NVMe SSD by writing garbage. It was fast first 30 seconds. In the end sustained write speed was around 60 MB/s. My old HDD works faster. It's fast enough in day-to-day usage, though.
qwerty456127 5y ago
> Problem is that hibernation is slooow It isn't. It can add just some seconds (probably less than 5 on fast SSDs, even less if you don't have too much RAM). If people can't wait this little they need to have their lives / jobs / mental health fixed rather than add more orders of complexity (with according increase in problems) into the computers.
- widerporst 5y ago
  Depends on your definition of slow. On my work laptop (modern HP Elitebook), sleep doesn't work at all (laptop just turns on again after going to sleep), so I'm using hibernate exclusively. Waking up from hibernate takes longer than one minute. On the other hand, my private laptop (Huawei Matebook) wakes up from sleep in less than 10 seconds.
  - Dhrhdhxbxbx 5y ago
    Seems like something is wrong. Are extra BIOS checks enabled? My Linux Redmibook with 16 GB of RAM and a cheap SSD takes 5-6 seconds to restore from hibernate.
  - zweifuss 5y ago
    On my MateBook 13 (2020) the Fn and Shift Lock lights are turned on, while the laptop is still powerd on, but not under OS control anymore: Sleep takes 6 seconds down and 2 seconds up. Hibernation is 9 seconds down and 20isch seconds up. Shutdown is 20isch down and Boot is 22isch to desktop (fastboot=off).
- dragontamer 5y ago
  Slower than an iPad, so more people will use a tablet to do their day to day activities rather than the laptop.
kawsper 5y ago
Fedora doesn't even create swap partitions anymore, so you have to enable that first to enable hibernation, enabling it requires you to create a swap-partition, change things in systemd and meddle with the grub-configuration: https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/fedora-hibernate.html https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/fedora-hibernate.html
- Dhrhdhxbxbx 5y ago
  Hibernation should work fine with a swap file. I've been using it without issues on my Xiaomi Redmibook on a btrfs partition: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Power_management/Suspend_and_hibernate#Hibernation_into_swap_file https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Power_management/Suspend_an...
- sprayk 5y ago
  if you use secure boot, you cannot use hibernation under fedora (or any Linux, afaik) since there is no way to "seal" the hibernation image from modification by an attacker who could mount the swap on another OS where they have root. this is regardless of disk encryption.
  - einnhverr 5y ago
    I don't know precisely how secure boot works under fedora, but you can have FDE with swap just fine in Linux. A swap partition can live inside a LVM logical volume. For secure boot I would guess you could have the EFI partition signed/validated with the TPM.
    - vladvasiliu 5y ago
      This. In my case, I use SecureBoot to check the boot image's signature (contains the kernel + initrd + boot params). Then it starts everything from an LVM that lives on top of LUKS. I always have to type in the password (never bothered to get the TPM working), but I don't see why the TPM wouldn't be able to do it. From the system boot point of view, it just starts an OS. The OS will then proceed to load some data in RAM. It's its business whether this is "fresh" data for a new boot, or "old" data from the last boot.
comeonseriously 5y ago
Hibernation should not be too slow now with SSDs clocking upwards of 3000MB/s
rickdeckard 5y ago
Hibernation is not slow on modern PCs (XPS-15 9500 here), the problem is that Windows 10 can wake the PC from Hibernation at any time, and there's no option in BIOS to prevent that. I chased all the sources using Windows Event-log and "powercfg /lastwake" and then disable each, but it took DAYS to find them all and make sure it now stays in hibernation.
- horsawlarway 5y ago
  Agree - coming back from hibernation is very fast on these machines (XPS-13 9300 here). I have Arch configured to hibernate on lid close, and it's only about 8 seconds from lid open to a working login. It also means I don't lose 5%-20% of my battery each night.
- frosted-flakes 5y ago
  I had this problem with mt desktop PC, which would randomly wake up from hibernation in the middle of the night. My computer was in my bedroom, so this was very much a problem since the bright screen would always wake me up. I couldn't even shut off the screen since it didn't have a power button (Apple Thunderbolt display). My solution was to reach around to the back of the tower and cycle the PSU power switch after hibernating the PC, every time.
mirker 5y ago
I am quite confused. I thought Windows 10 “fast boot” was hibernation and default “shutdown” behavior. I thought Windows 10 startup times were faster because of hibernation shortcutting the real boot sequence.
- ymosy 5y ago
  Windows 8 and later enable “fast boot” by default which, on shutdown, logs the user out of the current session and then hibernates the logged out state of the OS by writing the RAM contents to disk. “Full” hibernation is still there, it’s just disabled by default in the UI but not on the OS level. There’s also this “hybrid sleep” concept introduced since Vista where an OS would go from Sleep state to Hibernate automatically after 180 minutes of Sleep (IIRC, also can be overridden by the OEM) to save the laptop battery further since after the laptop hibernates it’s effectively off. It’s really confusing and a hell to troubleshoot if something goes wrong. I think Microsoft was trying to apply smart decisions on the OS level _for_ the user but there’s no real indication of what’s actually happening with the system. The naming doesn’t help either, especially after “Modern Sleep” has been introduced. EDIT: I decided to check myself because I wasn’t sure and it turns out I was indeed wrong. “Hybrid Sleep” is actually about a device going to Sleep and Hibernate simultaneously - it’s so that you can still resume from the hibernated image on the disk in case battery dies while in Sleep. At the same time, you can resume from Sleep right away even before parallel hibernation is finished. I think the intention is that you kinda get the best of both worlds here. The behavior of going to sleep to hibernate after some time which I’ve described originally is actually something that was there since at least Windows XP.

by zokier 5y ago

Hibernation in Windows hasn't gone anywhere. I have a Dell laptop in front of me and it has hibernate in the start menu as normal. Problem is that hibernation is slooow so people don't like to use it

thaumasiotes 5y ago

I have a Dell laptop I bought within the last couple of months. Hibernate is not in the start menu, and the option to add it to the start menu has been disabled. It's still possible to assign "hibernate" as the action taken in response to various power-related actions such as closing the lid or pressing the power button. This makes no sense; I'm not sure what's going on.

RGamma 5y ago
You can enable the start menu hibernate button in advanced power settings: System -> Power & sleep -> Additional power settings -> Choose what the power buttons do -> Change settings that are currently unavailable -> Check Hibernate. And then get lucky that your laptop wakes up again (mine dies 1 out of 10 times) Edit: sorry, can't read.
- thaumasiotes 5y ago
  No, you can't; that option is disabled. It cannot be checked. I don't know how I can state this more clearly. "Turn on fast startup (recommended)" is checked, and that option is also disabled and can't be unchecked, despite obviously being undesirable.
  - lozenge 5y ago
    Maybe you have Group Policy settings? Sometimes "Windows tweaker" type apps install these. Also, mine has a link "Change settings that are currently unavailable" which shows a UAC prompt and then enables all checkboxes.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - frosted-flakes 5y ago
    The checkbox is disabled by default. To enable it you have to click the "Allow advanced options" button at the top of the page.

y4mi 5y ago

Why though? My drive can write with up to 3gb/s. I only have 32 gb of ram, so the process should take at most 10s. Generally less, as a lot is usually free.

sprayk 5y ago
you have 32 GiB of RAM, gibibytes, meaning 32 * 1024^3. does your drive write at 3 GB/s (gigabytes) or Gb/s (gigabits)? if little b bits, it'll be more like 80 sec
- vladvasiliu 5y ago
  Probably "big b". 3 Gb/s (small b) is approximately 350 MB/s (big b). My 9-year-old SATA SSD does better than that.
- deleted 5y ago
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- deleted 5y ago
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- deleted 5y ago
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- y4mi 5y ago
  if this comment is serious i strongly suggest you inform yourself about nvme drives. they're absolutely worth their money. i haven't encountered anyone in years that didn't have at least one in their pc/laptop, but if you dont: i strongly suggest you buy one. because writing 30 Gbyte sequentially generally does takes about 10 seconds.
  - vbezhenar 5y ago
    When I got my work laptop, first thing I did is erased its NVMe SSD by writing garbage. It was fast first 30 seconds. In the end sustained write speed was around 60 MB/s. My old HDD works faster. It's fast enough in day-to-day usage, though.

qwerty456127 5y ago

> Problem is that hibernation is slooow It isn't. It can add just some seconds (probably less than 5 on fast SSDs, even less if you don't have too much RAM). If people can't wait this little they need to have their lives / jobs / mental health fixed rather than add more orders of complexity (with according increase in problems) into the computers.

widerporst 5y ago
Depends on your definition of slow. On my work laptop (modern HP Elitebook), sleep doesn't work at all (laptop just turns on again after going to sleep), so I'm using hibernate exclusively. Waking up from hibernate takes longer than one minute. On the other hand, my private laptop (Huawei Matebook) wakes up from sleep in less than 10 seconds.
- Dhrhdhxbxbx 5y ago
  Seems like something is wrong. Are extra BIOS checks enabled? My Linux Redmibook with 16 GB of RAM and a cheap SSD takes 5-6 seconds to restore from hibernate.
- zweifuss 5y ago
  On my MateBook 13 (2020) the Fn and Shift Lock lights are turned on, while the laptop is still powerd on, but not under OS control anymore: Sleep takes 6 seconds down and 2 seconds up. Hibernation is 9 seconds down and 20isch seconds up. Shutdown is 20isch down and Boot is 22isch to desktop (fastboot=off).
dragontamer 5y ago
Slower than an iPad, so more people will use a tablet to do their day to day activities rather than the laptop.

kawsper 5y ago

Fedora doesn't even create swap partitions anymore, so you have to enable that first to enable hibernation, enabling it requires you to create a swap-partition, change things in systemd and meddle with the grub-configuration: https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/fedora-hibernate.html https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/fedora-hibernate.html

Dhrhdhxbxbx 5y ago
Hibernation should work fine with a swap file. I've been using it without issues on my Xiaomi Redmibook on a btrfs partition: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Power_management/Suspend_and_hibernate#Hibernation_into_swap_file https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Power_management/Suspend_an...
sprayk 5y ago
if you use secure boot, you cannot use hibernation under fedora (or any Linux, afaik) since there is no way to "seal" the hibernation image from modification by an attacker who could mount the swap on another OS where they have root. this is regardless of disk encryption.
- einnhverr 5y ago
  I don't know precisely how secure boot works under fedora, but you can have FDE with swap just fine in Linux. A swap partition can live inside a LVM logical volume. For secure boot I would guess you could have the EFI partition signed/validated with the TPM.
  - vladvasiliu 5y ago
    This. In my case, I use SecureBoot to check the boot image's signature (contains the kernel + initrd + boot params). Then it starts everything from an LVM that lives on top of LUKS. I always have to type in the password (never bothered to get the TPM working), but I don't see why the TPM wouldn't be able to do it. From the system boot point of view, it just starts an OS. The OS will then proceed to load some data in RAM. It's its business whether this is "fresh" data for a new boot, or "old" data from the last boot.

comeonseriously 5y ago

Hibernation should not be too slow now with SSDs clocking upwards of 3000MB/s

rickdeckard 5y ago

Hibernation is not slow on modern PCs (XPS-15 9500 here), the problem is that Windows 10 can wake the PC from Hibernation at any time, and there's no option in BIOS to prevent that. I chased all the sources using Windows Event-log and "powercfg /lastwake" and then disable each, but it took DAYS to find them all and make sure it now stays in hibernation.

horsawlarway 5y ago
Agree - coming back from hibernation is very fast on these machines (XPS-13 9300 here). I have Arch configured to hibernate on lid close, and it's only about 8 seconds from lid open to a working login. It also means I don't lose 5%-20% of my battery each night.
frosted-flakes 5y ago
I had this problem with mt desktop PC, which would randomly wake up from hibernation in the middle of the night. My computer was in my bedroom, so this was very much a problem since the bright screen would always wake me up. I couldn't even shut off the screen since it didn't have a power button (Apple Thunderbolt display). My solution was to reach around to the back of the tower and cycle the PSU power switch after hibernating the PC, every time.

mirker 5y ago

I am quite confused. I thought Windows 10 “fast boot” was hibernation and default “shutdown” behavior. I thought Windows 10 startup times were faster because of hibernation shortcutting the real boot sequence.

ymosy 5y ago
Windows 8 and later enable “fast boot” by default which, on shutdown, logs the user out of the current session and then hibernates the logged out state of the OS by writing the RAM contents to disk. “Full” hibernation is still there, it’s just disabled by default in the UI but not on the OS level. There’s also this “hybrid sleep” concept introduced since Vista where an OS would go from Sleep state to Hibernate automatically after 180 minutes of Sleep (IIRC, also can be overridden by the OEM) to save the laptop battery further since after the laptop hibernates it’s effectively off. It’s really confusing and a hell to troubleshoot if something goes wrong. I think Microsoft was trying to apply smart decisions on the OS level _for_ the user but there’s no real indication of what’s actually happening with the system. The naming doesn’t help either, especially after “Modern Sleep” has been introduced. EDIT: I decided to check myself because I wasn’t sure and it turns out I was indeed wrong. “Hybrid Sleep” is actually about a device going to Sleep and Hibernate simultaneously - it’s so that you can still resume from the hibernated image on the disk in case battery dies while in Sleep. At the same time, you can resume from Sleep right away even before parallel hibernation is finished. I think the intention is that you kinda get the best of both worlds here. The behavior of going to sleep to hibernate after some time which I’ve described originally is actually something that was there since at least Windows XP.