4 ms·

This is already a change from previous legislation that effectively mandated micro-USB. So yeah, it can be done.

by toyg 5y ago

rglullis 5y ago
Does it count if no one ever complied to this legislation? Where are the micro-usb iPhones?
- lrem 5y ago
  Apple complied by adding a free dongle to every iPhone sold in the EU.
  - rglullis 5y ago
    That's the opposite of compliance. Not only they didn't get to change their own product to match some standard, they went straight against the spirit of the law (add more electronics and yet-another source of waste).
    - shawnz 5y ago
      It was still considered a success because it at least reduced the need for proprietary AC adapters. Now it seems they want to expand on that to fix the proprietary cable/dongle issue too.
      - jaywalk 5y ago
        You never needed a proprietary AC adapter to charge an iPhone, just a "proprietary" cable.
        shawnz 5y ago
        Without the dongle you couldn't use iPhones with micro-USB AC adapters that don't have detachable cables. However I agree that besides that specific circumstance, they were basically already compliant. The 2009 initiative wasn't targeting Apple specifically.
- toyg 5y ago
  Apple "complied" by putting USB-A on their chargers and calling it a day. EU authorities grumbled but didn't opt for a lenghty legal challenge; instead, they talked a bit more and came up with this updated legislation. Note how they give Apple something (the unbundled charger) while becoming more restrictive in other areas... if Apple continue taking the piss after this gets passed, I expect the hammer will come down.
  - rglullis 5y ago
    > I expect the hammer will come down. So, what are they going to do? Fine Apple for a couple of million euros? Give another reason for Apple to increase the prices of their products even more?
    - TazeTSchnitzel 5y ago
      They would block all shipments of Apple devices at the border of the EU after a certain point. The EU controls the customs rules for most of Europe.
      - rglullis 5y ago
        So, it's the latter. They will have another excuse to increase the prices further. "We had to spend $BILLIONS to change the design of the iPhone, so this is why the new iPhone EU Edition is going to be 1400€". This is the kind of thing that really makes me understand Brexit.
        toyg 5y ago
        Nobody forces you to buy a consumer-unfriendly product that also happens to be arbitrarily expensive. If somebody in Milan can't afford a Ferrari made in Maranello because the damn company insists in pricing their cars beyond what is reasonable for a 4-wheeled vehicle, it doesn't mean Milan should secede from Italy, surely.
        dmitriid 5y ago
Robotbeat 5y ago
Man, lightning is FAR better than the fragile micro-USB. I’ve had to repair microUSB ports multiple times.
- toyg 5y ago
  From the perspective of a free and non-monopolistic market, anything from the USB consortium is massively better than an expensive proprietary standard controlled by a single vendor. Technical superiority is not the point.
  - Robotbeat 5y ago
    I would say it’s easily possible to pick a standard that is so subpar compared to a proprietary one that it’s worse for the consumer. A solution would be to just require any port used to be freely available and open. Require Apple to open the lightning standard and make IP related to it unenforceable.
    - toyg 5y ago
      So you are a communist thieve of IP !!11!! Who will ever design a plug again, if it can be stolen from them by the government?!?!? /s Honestly, this is the result of dialogue between consumers, authorities, and manufacturers, including Apple. It tries to do the right thing under the circumstances. Apple could have avoided this sort of thing entirely if they were only a bit less greedy than they are.
      - galgalesh 5y ago
        > So you are a communist thieve of IP !!11!! Who will ever design a plug again, if it can be stolen from them by the government?!?!? /s "jokes" like that are counter-productive to a good discussion. HN is not a place for such comments. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- asddubs 5y ago
  micro usb does kind of suck, but it's vastly better than every phone having a different proprietary charger like it was before smartphones

This is already a change from previous legislation that effectively mandated micro-USB. So yeah, it can be done.

by toyg 5y ago

This is already a change from previous legislation that effectively mandated micro-USB. So yeah, it can be done.

rglullis 5y ago

Does it count if no one ever complied to this legislation? Where are the micro-usb iPhones?

lrem 5y ago
Apple complied by adding a free dongle to every iPhone sold in the EU.
- rglullis 5y ago
  That's the opposite of compliance. Not only they didn't get to change their own product to match some standard, they went straight against the spirit of the law (add more electronics and yet-another source of waste).
  - shawnz 5y ago
    It was still considered a success because it at least reduced the need for proprietary AC adapters. Now it seems they want to expand on that to fix the proprietary cable/dongle issue too.
    - jaywalk 5y ago
      You never needed a proprietary AC adapter to charge an iPhone, just a "proprietary" cable.
      - shawnz 5y ago
        Without the dongle you couldn't use iPhones with micro-USB AC adapters that don't have detachable cables. However I agree that besides that specific circumstance, they were basically already compliant. The 2009 initiative wasn't targeting Apple specifically.
toyg 5y ago
Apple "complied" by putting USB-A on their chargers and calling it a day. EU authorities grumbled but didn't opt for a lenghty legal challenge; instead, they talked a bit more and came up with this updated legislation. Note how they give Apple something (the unbundled charger) while becoming more restrictive in other areas... if Apple continue taking the piss after this gets passed, I expect the hammer will come down.
- rglullis 5y ago
  > I expect the hammer will come down. So, what are they going to do? Fine Apple for a couple of million euros? Give another reason for Apple to increase the prices of their products even more?
  - TazeTSchnitzel 5y ago
    They would block all shipments of Apple devices at the border of the EU after a certain point. The EU controls the customs rules for most of Europe.
    - rglullis 5y ago
      So, it's the latter. They will have another excuse to increase the prices further. "We had to spend $BILLIONS to change the design of the iPhone, so this is why the new iPhone EU Edition is going to be 1400€". This is the kind of thing that really makes me understand Brexit.
      - toyg 5y ago
        Nobody forces you to buy a consumer-unfriendly product that also happens to be arbitrarily expensive. If somebody in Milan can't afford a Ferrari made in Maranello because the damn company insists in pricing their cars beyond what is reasonable for a 4-wheeled vehicle, it doesn't mean Milan should secede from Italy, surely.
        dmitriid 5y ago

Robotbeat 5y ago

Man, lightning is FAR better than the fragile micro-USB. I’ve had to repair microUSB ports multiple times.

toyg 5y ago
From the perspective of a free and non-monopolistic market, anything from the USB consortium is massively better than an expensive proprietary standard controlled by a single vendor. Technical superiority is not the point.
- Robotbeat 5y ago
  I would say it’s easily possible to pick a standard that is so subpar compared to a proprietary one that it’s worse for the consumer. A solution would be to just require any port used to be freely available and open. Require Apple to open the lightning standard and make IP related to it unenforceable.
  - toyg 5y ago
    So you are a communist thieve of IP !!11!! Who will ever design a plug again, if it can be stolen from them by the government?!?!? /s Honestly, this is the result of dialogue between consumers, authorities, and manufacturers, including Apple. It tries to do the right thing under the circumstances. Apple could have avoided this sort of thing entirely if they were only a bit less greedy than they are.
    - galgalesh 5y ago
      > So you are a communist thieve of IP !!11!! Who will ever design a plug again, if it can be stolen from them by the government?!?!? /s "jokes" like that are counter-productive to a good discussion. HN is not a place for such comments. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
asddubs 5y ago
micro usb does kind of suck, but it's vastly better than every phone having a different proprietary charger like it was before smartphones