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Clearly these lawmakers don't understand that USBC cables are not readily interchangeable from one device to another. I don't even blame them, the USB foundatio

Clearly these lawmakers don't understand that USBC cables are not readily interchangeable from one device to another. I don't even blame them, the USB foundation made the mother of all marketing blunders with this standard.

diffeomorphism 5y ago
For charging? They pretty much are. For everything else? Maybe with somewhat reduced speed/features but good enough.
- HPsquared 5y ago
  Do they all support the high voltage modes? USB PD goes up to 20V/5A (100W). https://www.cui.com/blog/usb-type-c-pd-and-pps#usb-power-delivery https://www.cui.com/blog/usb-type-c-pd-and-pps#usb-power-del...
  - doikor 5y ago
    Yes. The A4 and A9 (A1 and A19 are ground) are the only pins that transmit power. Putting 20V/5A through the copper is not a problem even for the cheapest cable. edit: Ok looking at the other reply with the link to the google engineers stuff some have messed up the A5 (configuration channel) pin and thus the negotiation for giving more power fails and just defaults to normal levels that are safe for any device.
    - HPsquared 5y ago
      Sure the wire can almost certainly handle it, but are the contacts always going to be able to handle 5A? They are very small after all, and not treated very nicely. Not sure how it's handled by the protocol, but I've known cables to get hot due to contact resistance.
  - lovemenot 5y ago
    Yes, and if approved USB PD EPR (extended power range) proposal, will take it to 240 Watts over USB-C connectors. This moves USB close to the domain in which government regulation has long been necessary for safety reasons. It may be the case that the EU believes a standard domestic DC power supply is imminent and the EU believes PD (EPR) over USB-C meets the need. If so, that would make sense, and I am pleased to see the EU trying to get ahead to standardise and remove risk from vendors as well as consumers. By analogy, California had no natural right to export its CAFE automotive regulations. Yet CA had the foresight to cause that to happen anyway. Bravo.
- sokoloff 5y ago
  > For charging? They pretty much are [the same]. If only that were true: https://www.engadget.com/2015-11-04-google-pixel-engineer-vs-shoddy-usb-type-c-cables.html https://www.engadget.com/2015-11-04-google-pixel-engineer-vs... I've had more trouble with crappy USB-C cables [charging only] in the short time that's been a thing than the entire time of micro-USB.
p4l4g4 5y ago
Just charged my phone with my laptops Usb-C charger, without any issue. Apart from special features like fast-charge, I'd say compatibility is very good.
- Invictus0 5y ago
  I used to work at a company whose products included USB-C ports that only supported cable insertion in a single orientation--if the cable was inserted incorrectly, it would fry the board. Manufacturers have a lot of freedom to cut corners with this standard in all different places, and you better believe that they are going to do that to the greatest possible extent.
  - toyg 5y ago
    Warranty laws in the EU (2 years mandatory) make this less of a problem - eventually a manufacturer must realize they'll make more money doing things right than replacing tons of fried returns.
    - Invictus0 5y ago
      This particular company simply made USB-C cables with massive overmolded pokeyokes that ensured they could only be inserted in the proper orientation--which works great until some poor bastard comes along and tries to assemble the thing with the cable he brought from home. Oh well, not my problem anymore.
vanviegen 5y ago
That was my initial thought as well. But by forcing more unity in fast-charge protocol variants and by requiring clear information about required/delivered power on the packaging, it seems that they have an answer to this.

diffeomorphism 5y ago

For charging? They pretty much are. For everything else? Maybe with somewhat reduced speed/features but good enough.

HPsquared 5y ago
Do they all support the high voltage modes? USB PD goes up to 20V/5A (100W). https://www.cui.com/blog/usb-type-c-pd-and-pps#usb-power-delivery https://www.cui.com/blog/usb-type-c-pd-and-pps#usb-power-del...
- doikor 5y ago
  Yes. The A4 and A9 (A1 and A19 are ground) are the only pins that transmit power. Putting 20V/5A through the copper is not a problem even for the cheapest cable. edit: Ok looking at the other reply with the link to the google engineers stuff some have messed up the A5 (configuration channel) pin and thus the negotiation for giving more power fails and just defaults to normal levels that are safe for any device.
  - HPsquared 5y ago
    Sure the wire can almost certainly handle it, but are the contacts always going to be able to handle 5A? They are very small after all, and not treated very nicely. Not sure how it's handled by the protocol, but I've known cables to get hot due to contact resistance.
- lovemenot 5y ago
  Yes, and if approved USB PD EPR (extended power range) proposal, will take it to 240 Watts over USB-C connectors. This moves USB close to the domain in which government regulation has long been necessary for safety reasons. It may be the case that the EU believes a standard domestic DC power supply is imminent and the EU believes PD (EPR) over USB-C meets the need. If so, that would make sense, and I am pleased to see the EU trying to get ahead to standardise and remove risk from vendors as well as consumers. By analogy, California had no natural right to export its CAFE automotive regulations. Yet CA had the foresight to cause that to happen anyway. Bravo.
sokoloff 5y ago
> For charging? They pretty much are [the same]. If only that were true: https://www.engadget.com/2015-11-04-google-pixel-engineer-vs-shoddy-usb-type-c-cables.html https://www.engadget.com/2015-11-04-google-pixel-engineer-vs... I've had more trouble with crappy USB-C cables [charging only] in the short time that's been a thing than the entire time of micro-USB.

p4l4g4 5y ago

Just charged my phone with my laptops Usb-C charger, without any issue. Apart from special features like fast-charge, I'd say compatibility is very good.

Invictus0 5y ago
I used to work at a company whose products included USB-C ports that only supported cable insertion in a single orientation--if the cable was inserted incorrectly, it would fry the board. Manufacturers have a lot of freedom to cut corners with this standard in all different places, and you better believe that they are going to do that to the greatest possible extent.
- toyg 5y ago
  Warranty laws in the EU (2 years mandatory) make this less of a problem - eventually a manufacturer must realize they'll make more money doing things right than replacing tons of fried returns.
  - Invictus0 5y ago
    This particular company simply made USB-C cables with massive overmolded pokeyokes that ensured they could only be inserted in the proper orientation--which works great until some poor bastard comes along and tries to assemble the thing with the cable he brought from home. Oh well, not my problem anymore.

vanviegen 5y ago

That was my initial thought as well. But by forcing more unity in fast-charge protocol variants and by requiring clear information about required/delivered power on the packaging, it seems that they have an answer to this.