5 ms·

>If they would just make it work right the first time, the way software used to be developed Was this ever true? Was there really some golden age where everyt

by jayd16 5y ago

>If they would just make it work right the first time, the way software used to be developed Was this ever true? Was there really some golden age where everything worked or were we just blissfully ignorant to the problems?

nikanj 5y ago
Generally most of my electronics that contain a microcontroller but no internet have been bug free. I think part of this comes from the much smaller testing surface - my old vacuum cleaner has one button for power and one dial for suction power, so it's quite simple to write a bug-free implementation. Same for my dishwasher, laundry machine, etc. They generally come with a very limited number of inputs, and a microcontroller that runs through a state machine based on the inputs.
darkmatterrat 5y ago
I don't know how old you are but things pre-internet electronics just worked, because there it was assumed that there was probably connection. Before everything was internet connected. Yes everything did just work until component failure. * Games consoles and games were plug and play. Until the PS3 (late 2000s), none of the game consoles required any sort of updates. Yes there was hardware revisions but what you bought in the box was what you got. * Most computers before the PC was dominate in the UK, just switched on and you operated them. * Mobile phones didn't require updates, the only thing I need to do once was restart the phone because the sim needed to update a setting because I wasn't receiving SMS. These old nokia phones still work btw and my newer smart phones many don't work or can't be updated now. * Almost all my media was on VHS and/or Cassette. As long as the player worked, my media would play. I tend to do a lot of retro-gaming / retro computing now and all this stuff that is pre-internet and doesn't assume an internet connection just works (even on modern operating systems) without much interference. There was of course bad products, but they didn't require an internet connection either so it was just a bad product that you replaced with something better if you cared to.
fxtentacle 5y ago
Playstation 2 games were generally bug free. Same goes for Nintendo cartridges.
- timw4mail 5y ago
  Probably not bug free, but the bugs that remained were subtle enough to be difficult to notice, or they happened in rare circumstances, or they actually worked to the benefit of the game. Video games have never been produced in an environment where bugs can be completely stamped out.
- jayd16 5y ago
  Those games had a ton of bugs. Look into speed run tech. Super Mario World even has an arbitrary code execution bug you can trigger from controller input. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_KsonqcMv0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_KsonqcMv0
- cortesoft 5y ago
  This is completely not true, all those old games had tons of bugs. I think we don't think of them as having a ton of bugs for a few reasons; one, we didn't have the social media forums to post bugs and read about them, so unless you personally encountered a bug, you wouldn't know about it. Since most bugs only trigger under rare circumstances, most people aren't going to know about them. Secondly, since we knew there were never going to be updates, we didn't think about things not working as being 'bugs' that can be fixed... they became just part of the game.
  - jfrunyon 5y ago
    > Since most bugs only trigger under rare circumstances That's true of old games (when updates couldn't be delivered), but certainly not any newer AAA game at release that I can think of.
bluGill 5y ago
Sort of. Some things were - and still are a lot better. I've been in companies where all software is assumed to spend 6 months in test after it is finished - the customers would then do 3 months of extensive lab testing and only if it passed would they buy it so perfection was needed.

by jayd16 5y ago

nikanj 5y ago

Generally most of my electronics that contain a microcontroller but no internet have been bug free. I think part of this comes from the much smaller testing surface - my old vacuum cleaner has one button for power and one dial for suction power, so it's quite simple to write a bug-free implementation. Same for my dishwasher, laundry machine, etc. They generally come with a very limited number of inputs, and a microcontroller that runs through a state machine based on the inputs.

darkmatterrat 5y ago

I don't know how old you are but things pre-internet electronics just worked, because there it was assumed that there was probably connection. Before everything was internet connected. Yes everything did just work until component failure. * Games consoles and games were plug and play. Until the PS3 (late 2000s), none of the game consoles required any sort of updates. Yes there was hardware revisions but what you bought in the box was what you got. * Most computers before the PC was dominate in the UK, just switched on and you operated them. * Mobile phones didn't require updates, the only thing I need to do once was restart the phone because the sim needed to update a setting because I wasn't receiving SMS. These old nokia phones still work btw and my newer smart phones many don't work or can't be updated now. * Almost all my media was on VHS and/or Cassette. As long as the player worked, my media would play. I tend to do a lot of retro-gaming / retro computing now and all this stuff that is pre-internet and doesn't assume an internet connection just works (even on modern operating systems) without much interference. There was of course bad products, but they didn't require an internet connection either so it was just a bad product that you replaced with something better if you cared to.

fxtentacle 5y ago

Playstation 2 games were generally bug free. Same goes for Nintendo cartridges.

timw4mail 5y ago
Probably not bug free, but the bugs that remained were subtle enough to be difficult to notice, or they happened in rare circumstances, or they actually worked to the benefit of the game. Video games have never been produced in an environment where bugs can be completely stamped out.
jayd16 5y ago
Those games had a ton of bugs. Look into speed run tech. Super Mario World even has an arbitrary code execution bug you can trigger from controller input. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_KsonqcMv0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_KsonqcMv0
cortesoft 5y ago
This is completely not true, all those old games had tons of bugs. I think we don't think of them as having a ton of bugs for a few reasons; one, we didn't have the social media forums to post bugs and read about them, so unless you personally encountered a bug, you wouldn't know about it. Since most bugs only trigger under rare circumstances, most people aren't going to know about them. Secondly, since we knew there were never going to be updates, we didn't think about things not working as being 'bugs' that can be fixed... they became just part of the game.
- jfrunyon 5y ago
  > Since most bugs only trigger under rare circumstances That's true of old games (when updates couldn't be delivered), but certainly not any newer AAA game at release that I can think of.

bluGill 5y ago

Sort of. Some things were - and still are a lot better. I've been in companies where all software is assumed to spend 6 months in test after it is finished - the customers would then do 3 months of extensive lab testing and only if it passed would they buy it so perfection was needed.