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> I really miss my Thinkpad Trackpoint This is one of those comments I will never understand. Every single time I have tried to use one of those things the onl

• OJFord 5y ago
  I've never had a laptop with one long enough to get used to it, but I assume it's because it's right there in the keyboard where your hands already are, rather than because it's any better at moving the pointer around than a trackpad/mouse.
• halotrope 5y ago
  Its all about leaving the hands on the home row. If you don‘t touch type you will not „get“ it.
• ip26 5y ago
  Imagine being able to mouse literally while you type. That's the Trackpoint, and it makes up for everything else about it.
• rockostrich 5y ago
  Maybe it's an acquired taste? I have fond memories of using nubs on ThinkPads. I think Apple's done a great job at improving the trackpad experience on Macbooks but it still doesn't compare to not needing to leave the keyboard and also never needing to lift your finger to continue moving the mouse.
• dnr 5y ago
  This is one of those religious arguments where no one will every change their mind, but I feel like a trackpad is the dumbest mouse interface and can't use anything but a trackpoint (or a mouse of course). Consider dragging and dropping: with a trackpoint you click with your thumb, then use your pointer finger to move the mouse cursor any distance you like, without moving your hand, then release. With a trackpad you press the pad and then move your finger some distance and then... oops, you hit the edge of the pad. Better abort and try again, starting the motion from the opposite pad. Except if I'm on a non-apple trackpad, and I have to click near the top of the pad, it's nearly impossible because the click hinge is near the top. Or maybe I do a finger swap to reset the drag position, and hope that the OS doesn't interpret my moment of two fingers touching as some kind of gesture. Anyway, it does take some time to get used to, so you won't get it in a few minutes or even a few hours. Try a week. Also make sure you're using a lenovo one (the dell/toshiba ones aren't as good), and very importantly, that you have a fresh cap. Worn out caps make it really frustrating.
  • turtlebits 5y ago
    While I'm not going to argue your preference for a trackpoint, dragging with a trackpad is not as you describe. You just leave your thumb "clicked" and reposition your index finger. IME, using a trackpoint is okay for smaller laptop screens, but going from monitor to monitor kinda sucks.
    • TimTheTinker 5y ago
      macOS has an option (in the accessibility prefs) to enable three-finger trackpad dragging. It's incredible to use, especially in concert with Magnet (a window management app). Three-finger-drag a window to the top of the screen and it's instantly maximized. Selecting text is also a breeze.
      • schmorptron 5y ago
        Does that not get in the way of the 3 finger swipe-up to open the activities screen?
        • TimTheTinker 5y ago
          Do you mean Mission Control? That can be configured in Trackpad prefs to respond to 4 finger swipe-up instead.
          • schmorptron 5y ago
            Yeah! Didn't know the mac name for it.
        • mdavidn 5y ago
          Mission Control and App Exposé change to 4-finger gestures after 3-finger dragging is enabled.
          • schmorptron 5y ago
• orthecreedence 5y ago
  It's phenomenal on airplanes and buses where your elbows are extremely constrained and you want to keep your hands on the keyboard.
• hyperion2010 5y ago
  Counterpoint. I won't use a keyboard without one. I use a mechanical keyboard with a trackpoint. Not having a trackpoint means that I don't even have to think about whether I will buy a laptop, I already know that I won't. Touchpads have gotten better, but nothing beats the nub. That being said, every laptop I have ever owned has had a trackpoint, so I'm a definitely biased.
  • bigpeopleareold 5y ago
    When I am on any laptop, the first impulse for me has always been to reach for the TrackPoint. I always get disoriented for a moment when it isn't on a laptop keyboard. I take the device for granted :) I really really do hope framework will add a trackpoint option in the future. I would hate to unlearn this comfortable feature now.
  • chx 5y ago
    > I use a mechanical keyboard with a trackpoint. Not having a trackpoint means that I don't even have to think about whether I will buy a laptop, I already know that I won't. Same here. TEX Shinobi?
    • hyperion2010 5y ago
      Yep.
      • rlonstein 5y ago
        :) We are legion
  • fouric 5y ago
    Did you build that keyboard yourself, or buy it pre-made? If the former, where did you get the trackpoint? I have a Dactyl-Manuform that is nearly perfect, modulo the trackpoint (and wireless, better firmware than QMK, and a few other things), and I'm looking for one that I can use without cannibalizing an innocent thinkpad keyboard.
• bigpeopleareold 5y ago
  I use both, but for different reasons. For touch typing (like I am doing for this comment), using it is much easier than moving the hands off the keyboard to get to the trackpad. I had to get used to it, but when I did, it's hard to not think of it there. When I am doing casual reading or I am doing more hurried work, I tend to use the trackpad more. It's feels more suitable for me as a mouse interface when the focus is not typing primarily but more about finding things. I learned to use a TrackPoint with some motivation that I would be using it a lot. I have instead found a comfortable middle point with using both of them.
• jklinger410 5y ago
  >This is the dumbest mouse interface I have ever seen And some people think, wow this is a great interface. Awesome comment!
• bm3719 5y ago
  I use these exclusively and have the trackpad disabled on my Thinkpad (an old x230). The #1 reason I use it is to not move my hands when I need to do a pointing operation. You can get very precise with it too, but it takes some getting used to. I'm a klutz with a trackpad now, since I've been using the pointer for so many years. I use a tiling window manager and very few GUI apps (often even using the web in w3m), so mousing isn't as important for me, which is another factor. I wouldn't play a video game with it, of course, but I'd imagine trackpads suck at those too.
• itomato 5y ago
  You don’t mouse like I do. Trackpoints come with The Proper Number of Buttons; 3. You copy and paste text with a trackpoint. You scroll with a trackpoint. You switch workspaces with a trackpoint. You can also mouse around, but it’s why there’s also a pad, bluetooth and USB. It’s not lesser, it is more, a lot more.
• uxcolumbo 5y ago
  It has a learning curve - for sure. But once you've got used to it in a couple of days, it's way more efficient than a trackpad for type and pointing activities. I don't have to move my arm compared to when using a trackpad. This is an interesting video: IBM introduces "Pointing Stick" (TrackPoint) (1990) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4Ss6F1qIHU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4Ss6F1qIHU
• poetaster 5y ago
  For all my love of chording and old macs, for that matter, trackpoint touch typist I will ever remain. I rever Doctorow, but I reward myself otherwise. Smoking Cuban on occassion. A new used thinkpad every 2 years or ssd. The builds run in obs and writing can nicely obtain on a light x220.
• fnord77 5y ago
  it was ok if you set the sensitivity to maximum. but then you had to train yourself to move the mouse accurately with the tiniest amount of pressure.
• fouric 5y ago
  There are many other replies about how the trackpoint is ergonomically superior to a trackpad. I'll add some nuance: it's entirely possible that a trackpoint is most valuable when your workload is majority typing with some mousing, as opposed to the other way around - so maybe you just have a different workload than most trackpoint users. Separately - how long did you actually spend trying to use one? Most things have learning curves. You can't unlock most of the potential of a keyboard until you've spent dozens of hours learning how to type, so why shouldn't the same apply to a pointing device?
  • hamburglar 5y ago
    I personally used to swear by the trackpoint because it was vastly superior to the touchpads of the time. A decent touchpad (definitely not the plastic shit they put on most thinkpads these days — they are unusable) blows it away though. Now I find using a trackpoint feels like moving my mouse with arrow keys. It’s just repulsive to me.
• stkdump 5y ago
  Another opinion: my first laptop was a Toshiba with a trackpoint. That was awesome. I was able to move the cursor much faster and more accurately than with a normal mouse, even disregarding the time it takes to move the hand between a mouse and a keyboard. When I first had to use a touchpad, years later, I was stunned that people put up with such an experience. Nowadays I am on a Thinkpad, but I still feel like Toshiba had it figured out much better. Somehow it isn't as accurate as I remember it from back then.
• kelnos 5y ago
  I used Thinkpads many many years ago and liked (but did not love) the trackpoint. One thing it can be really good at is small, precision movements. Once I got to try a laptop with a decent touchpad, anyway, I saw no reason to go back.
• kybernetikos 5y ago
  With a trackpoint you don't need to move your hand to move the mouse, so it's great for people who frequently use the laptop in low-elbow room situations like on a plane or train.
• esjeon 5y ago
  Welp, I used to play Tremulous[1] with it on my ThinkPad X61, slaying people with granger(= builder) on "X" server. I often spammed the chat when I get a fancy kill (something like "you got killed by a trackpoint lul", with color). I wonder if anyone remembers it. Hahaha Trackpoint is like a joystick, very short but sensitive and accurate. The best experience was with a SoftRim cap, which significantly reduced the force required to register. Even better, using VIM and tiling WM completely eliminates any reason for my hands to leave the resting position on the keyboard. This was simply fantastic, and that's why I still have my X61 around. [1]: https://tremulous.net/ https://tremulous.net/
  • znpy 5y ago
    Kudos for playing trem, I used to love that game as a teenager.