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The true price of a gallon of gasoline is probably higher than $7.60 if you account for the lasting damage to the planet. We are subsidizing the use of non-ren

by Tepix 5y ago

The true price of a gallon of gasoline is probably higher than $7.60 if you account for the lasting damage to the planet. We are subsidizing the use of non-renewables in general by not taxing them enough (or even subsidizing them).

nanis 5y ago
Conflating cost and price is a common habit it seems. You get paid $22. That gets you about 2.9 gallons of gasoline in Denmark which converts to about $10 in the United States. So, talking about how much the gross pay of Danish workers is without thinking at all about what they can afford to buy with that money is a true mark of economic ignorance. The original point was that Matt Bruenig is a champagne socialist. "Denmark is great" is not a counter-argument to that.
- Kim_Bruning 5y ago
  I'm pretty sure people in Denmark are not as tied to gasoline as they are in the USA. The country is smaller to begin with, and likely has better public transport, cycling, and pedestrian facilities. I guess the next major costs to compare are rent and health insurance?
  - liversage 5y ago
    Health care is free in Denmark. You don't need insurance. If you really want to you can buy insurance to lower the cost of some treatments that are not covered like physiotherapy, dentistry etc.
- nielsbot 5y ago
  But you’re only talking about gasoline prices.
- elzbardico 5y ago
  Ok, let's now compare the price of a medical procedure...
- consp 5y ago
  The need for gasoline in the US is by design and Denmark does not force you to own a car like in the US. Also, US gasoline is heavily subsidized so I guess you should count that as a tax break as well for the US scenario which makes the entire comparison even less normal.
  - meragrin_ 5y ago
    > Also, US gasoline is heavily subsidized How so?
    - teh_klev 5y ago
      First hit on google for "US gasoline subsidies": https://www.brookings.edu/research/reforming-global-fossil-fuel-subsidies-how-the-united-states-can-restart-international-cooperation/#:~:text=The%20Environmental%20and%20Energy%20Study,revenue%20by%20around%20%2411.5%20billion https://www.brookings.edu/research/reforming-global-fossil-f....
      - meragrin_ 5y ago
        Still not seeing any subsidies. Subtracting costs from revenue is not a subsidy.
mrep 5y ago
This website [0] will offset your carbon at $5 per 1000 pounds which is about 50 gallons of gas giving a per gallon offset cost of only 10 cents (just an example). Roads on the other hand at whopping 416 billion dollars in the US in 2014 [1] would add a lot more if you paid for them all with a fuel tax. At 123 billion gallons of gas [2] and 44 billion gallons of diesel [3], that would require $2.50 worth of tax per gallon. Gas near me is $3.40 with a 60 cent tax so I'd say $5.40 sounds about right to me. [0]: https://terrapass.com/product/personal-carbon-offset-grouped https://terrapass.com/product/personal-carbon-offset-grouped [1]: https://www.bidnet.com/resources/business-insights/us-government-spending-highway-infrastructure-en.jsp#:~:text=The%20federal%20contribution%20amounted%20to,local%20roads%2C%20bridges%20and%20tunnels https://www.bidnet.com/resources/business-insights/us-govern.... [2]: https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23&t=10#:~:text=In%202020%2C%20about%20123.73%20billion,8.05%20million%20barrels%20per%20day https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23&t=10#:~:text=In...). [3]: https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/diesel-fuel/use-of-diesel.php#:~:text=In%202020%2C%20distillate%20fuel%20consumption,122%20million%20gallons%20per%20day https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/diesel-fuel/use-of-diese.... > At 123 billion gallons of gas [0] and 44 billion gallons of diesel [3],

by Tepix 5y ago

nanis 5y ago

Conflating cost and price is a common habit it seems. You get paid $22. That gets you about 2.9 gallons of gasoline in Denmark which converts to about $10 in the United States. So, talking about how much the gross pay of Danish workers is without thinking at all about what they can afford to buy with that money is a true mark of economic ignorance. The original point was that Matt Bruenig is a champagne socialist. "Denmark is great" is not a counter-argument to that.

Kim_Bruning 5y ago
I'm pretty sure people in Denmark are not as tied to gasoline as they are in the USA. The country is smaller to begin with, and likely has better public transport, cycling, and pedestrian facilities. I guess the next major costs to compare are rent and health insurance?
- liversage 5y ago
  Health care is free in Denmark. You don't need insurance. If you really want to you can buy insurance to lower the cost of some treatments that are not covered like physiotherapy, dentistry etc.
nielsbot 5y ago
But you’re only talking about gasoline prices.
elzbardico 5y ago
Ok, let's now compare the price of a medical procedure...
consp 5y ago
The need for gasoline in the US is by design and Denmark does not force you to own a car like in the US. Also, US gasoline is heavily subsidized so I guess you should count that as a tax break as well for the US scenario which makes the entire comparison even less normal.
- meragrin_ 5y ago
  > Also, US gasoline is heavily subsidized How so?
  - teh_klev 5y ago
    First hit on google for "US gasoline subsidies": https://www.brookings.edu/research/reforming-global-fossil-fuel-subsidies-how-the-united-states-can-restart-international-cooperation/#:~:text=The%20Environmental%20and%20Energy%20Study,revenue%20by%20around%20%2411.5%20billion https://www.brookings.edu/research/reforming-global-fossil-f....
    - meragrin_ 5y ago
      Still not seeing any subsidies. Subtracting costs from revenue is not a subsidy.

mrep 5y ago

This website [0] will offset your carbon at $5 per 1000 pounds which is about 50 gallons of gas giving a per gallon offset cost of only 10 cents (just an example). Roads on the other hand at whopping 416 billion dollars in the US in 2014 [1] would add a lot more if you paid for them all with a fuel tax. At 123 billion gallons of gas [2] and 44 billion gallons of diesel [3], that would require $2.50 worth of tax per gallon. Gas near me is $3.40 with a 60 cent tax so I'd say $5.40 sounds about right to me. [0]: https://terrapass.com/product/personal-carbon-offset-grouped https://terrapass.com/product/personal-carbon-offset-grouped [1]: https://www.bidnet.com/resources/business-insights/us-government-spending-highway-infrastructure-en.jsp#:~:text=The%20federal%20contribution%20amounted%20to,local%20roads%2C%20bridges%20and%20tunnels https://www.bidnet.com/resources/business-insights/us-govern.... [2]: https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23&t=10#:~:text=In%202020%2C%20about%20123.73%20billion,8.05%20million%20barrels%20per%20day https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23&t=10#:~:text=In...). [3]: https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/diesel-fuel/use-of-diesel.php#:~:text=In%202020%2C%20distillate%20fuel%20consumption,122%20million%20gallons%20per%20day https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/diesel-fuel/use-of-diese.... > At 123 billion gallons of gas [0] and 44 billion gallons of diesel [3],