9 ms·

I’m wonder how it remains legal in the EU. Legislation really needs to step up on these things. It’s an American company that’s keeping taps on something like

by moksly 5y ago

I’m wonder how it remains legal in the EU. Legislation really needs to step up on these things. It’s an American company that’s keeping taps on something like 600 million European citizens. I don’t care what sort of “license agreement” it comes with, that’s just not ok.

tgsovlerkhgsel 5y ago
Legislation exists, enforcement is what's missing.
alpaca128 5y ago
At this point most governments and companies are dependent on Windows and don't want to or can't pay the price of a switch. Legal or not, I doubt anything will happen as long as this doesn't change.
- moksly 5y ago
  I don’t agree with that. I work in the public sector of Denmark and we haven’t had issues getting Microsoft to change things to meet our needs. Well we’re still struggling to get them to commit to never having Azure support work on our things with workers who aren’t EU citizens. But AWS complied with that rather quickly and Microsoft is bound to follow or lose a lot of business. And that last part is what’s important. It’s also why we can turn the telemetry off in the enterprise setups. So all you really need is someone high enough in the EU to make it stop and Microsoft will end it because it’s too valuable for them not to do so. You’re right that we can’t easily leave Microsoft in the public sector, and we don’t really wish to do so either as the education of millions of workers alone would be so expensive there is no business case, but we’re not as reliant on Windows as we once were. Almost all our systems have become platform independent, including office365, and more and more of our new hires have never used a Windows PC when they join us.
  - alpaca128 5y ago
    > It’s also why we can turn the telemetry off in the enterprise setups Good. But I'd prefer if the average EU citizen can have it turned off as well, by default. I can't pressure them with my single OEM license. Windows 10 is most likely not GDPR compliant and everyone knows it (I'd be very surprised if the hidden and sometimes impossible opt-out is fine). But aside from a ban in german schools[0] nothing is being done it seems. Amazon, Google, Facebook were all fined, I can't find anything about MS. [0] https://mspoweruser.com/german-privacy-commissioners-ban-windows-10-and-office-365-in-schools/ https://mspoweruser.com/german-privacy-commissioners-ban-win...
loa_in_ 5y ago
M$ terms and conditions, just like Android's terms and conditions, are very verbose and do tell you that you can either accept those terms or decline. But if you decline you can't install/setup the OS. So basically agree or go away. And since usage of either software isn't a human right, they're in the clear.
- philliphaydon 5y ago
  It’s 2021. Can we stop with the childish “m$”

by moksly 5y ago

tgsovlerkhgsel 5y ago

Legislation exists, enforcement is what's missing.

alpaca128 5y ago

At this point most governments and companies are dependent on Windows and don't want to or can't pay the price of a switch. Legal or not, I doubt anything will happen as long as this doesn't change.

moksly 5y ago
I don’t agree with that. I work in the public sector of Denmark and we haven’t had issues getting Microsoft to change things to meet our needs. Well we’re still struggling to get them to commit to never having Azure support work on our things with workers who aren’t EU citizens. But AWS complied with that rather quickly and Microsoft is bound to follow or lose a lot of business. And that last part is what’s important. It’s also why we can turn the telemetry off in the enterprise setups. So all you really need is someone high enough in the EU to make it stop and Microsoft will end it because it’s too valuable for them not to do so. You’re right that we can’t easily leave Microsoft in the public sector, and we don’t really wish to do so either as the education of millions of workers alone would be so expensive there is no business case, but we’re not as reliant on Windows as we once were. Almost all our systems have become platform independent, including office365, and more and more of our new hires have never used a Windows PC when they join us.
- alpaca128 5y ago
  > It’s also why we can turn the telemetry off in the enterprise setups Good. But I'd prefer if the average EU citizen can have it turned off as well, by default. I can't pressure them with my single OEM license. Windows 10 is most likely not GDPR compliant and everyone knows it (I'd be very surprised if the hidden and sometimes impossible opt-out is fine). But aside from a ban in german schools[0] nothing is being done it seems. Amazon, Google, Facebook were all fined, I can't find anything about MS. [0] https://mspoweruser.com/german-privacy-commissioners-ban-windows-10-and-office-365-in-schools/ https://mspoweruser.com/german-privacy-commissioners-ban-win...

loa_in_ 5y ago

M$ terms and conditions, just like Android's terms and conditions, are very verbose and do tell you that you can either accept those terms or decline. But if you decline you can't install/setup the OS. So basically agree or go away. And since usage of either software isn't a human right, they're in the clear.

philliphaydon 5y ago
It’s 2021. Can we stop with the childish “m$”