3 ms·

This is what I think my father must have meant when he said, "I hope you never visit SF because if you do you'll never leave." If I were 21ish and had gotten t

This is what I think my father must have meant when he said, "I hope you never visit SF because if you do you'll never leave." If I were 21ish and had gotten this far, I absolutely would have made this choice, and it absolutely (for me) would have been the wrongest choice I could have made in that moment. The credential matters, and is worth 10 fold the value of that checked box on interview applications. To the people whose opinion Simon likely cares about, it proves you can stick with something that's unpleasant long enough to see it through to completion. Completing college (or not, as it's something I haven't done) sticks with you in conversations, in social interactions, and in the minds of others. If you ever want to do anything besides bootstrap your own startup all the way to product/market fit (not as easy as you possibly think right now), not finishing college will create a little nugget of, if not doubt, then "prove it now" mentality in the heads of the people whose opinions you care about (both professionally e.g. investors and personally e.g. friends). If you're 20 or 21, your primary advantage is time. You do have the time to finish up college, and then do all of these things. You can do both, and pretending like you can't is just giving in to that underdeveloped prefrontal cortex. Simon, I hope I'm wrong, but this is a mistake. You will regret this.

paxys 5y ago
The credential matters – until you get your first job. A few years from now no employer (at least in tech) is going to reject him for not having a college degree when he has "Software Engineer at Facebook" on his resume. I was recently looking to switch jobs and actually removed the "education" section from my resume because it was taking too much space. Prospective employers care much more about work experience and other relevant projects than the college courses you took a decade ago.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  This has also been my experience. Without a degree, finding people interested in your CV is pretty tough. Once I started citing some previous contract work though, things started to open up. It's obviously no replacement for a degree, but I guess most people just want another party to vouch for your credibility.
- TameAntelope 5y ago
  True, until you attempt to move into an officer position at a company. It's a requirement for every organization I've spoken to or with colleagues about, both large companies and at startups. For very early stage startups, or if you're a cofounder, that's different. The further into in a company's lifetime, the more required it is, in my experience. In other words, it's a barrier to some things. Not to say that it's everyone's path, but I don't think everyone realizes that there is a ceiling, and it does not get easier to obtain an undergraduate degree than it is if you're 20 and have already completed three years worth of the program.
  - paxys 5y ago
    What is an "officer position"? I work at a large tech company (and have worked at several others, including Microsoft) and several of my directors, VPs and equivalent have had no formal degree. This is common when employees rise through the ranks or come in via acquisitions. Companies aren't going to ask for college transcripts when offering you a promotion. What matters is your experience and performance, that's it.
    - TameAntelope 5y ago
      A VP is an officer (a director is not), and I've worked with people who were asked for exactly those things when interviewing or being considered for such a promotion, both internally and interviewing for a role externally. I agree that what you say about experience and performance should be the only thing that matters, but it's naive to think that's simply "true", with no caveats, qualifications, or exceptions. I don't think it's as common as you think as you progress in your career beyond an individual contributor, generally in the tech industry, and specifically at Microsoft I'm 75% sure what you're saying is not the case, with a very small handful of exceptions.
      - zahllos 5y ago
        Another aspect to consider: this is all a very US-centric view. In the UK, getting hired without a degree is not impossible (I did it) but very difficult, and some processes will simply filter you out. Large employers like IBM want a 2.2 equivalent degree from a good-ish university, doesn't matter what, and you can potentially go and work for them. Even FAANG, those that are here, e.g. Google, Amazon, Facebook, will primarily recruit people with degrees. Ditching the degree will also make it harder to move abroad if you want to in the future, since most immigration formalities evaluate education level. This is definitely true when it comes to emigrating _into_ the US, for example. Also, if you ever decide you need to go back to university (school) to learn about something in the future, I don't know about the US, but in Europe, a condition of entry to masters programmes is always holding a bachelors degree. So if you have to go back to school here, likely you'll be going back to bachelors level. I don't even know how valuable your existing credits would be - I can tell you that they tend to expire in the EU. So, there are some consequences to this choice. I'm not judging, each to their own, but if it were me, I'd say life isn't a race and unless you are already sat on a potential unicorn and it 'has to be now' Bill-Gates-style, a couple more years while you finish your degree is nothing.
johntiger1 5y ago
If you have time, then why not do it later in life?

paxys 5y ago

The credential matters – until you get your first job. A few years from now no employer (at least in tech) is going to reject him for not having a college degree when he has "Software Engineer at Facebook" on his resume. I was recently looking to switch jobs and actually removed the "education" section from my resume because it was taking too much space. Prospective employers care much more about work experience and other relevant projects than the college courses you took a decade ago.

smoldesu 5y ago
This has also been my experience. Without a degree, finding people interested in your CV is pretty tough. Once I started citing some previous contract work though, things started to open up. It's obviously no replacement for a degree, but I guess most people just want another party to vouch for your credibility.
TameAntelope 5y ago
True, until you attempt to move into an officer position at a company. It's a requirement for every organization I've spoken to or with colleagues about, both large companies and at startups. For very early stage startups, or if you're a cofounder, that's different. The further into in a company's lifetime, the more required it is, in my experience. In other words, it's a barrier to some things. Not to say that it's everyone's path, but I don't think everyone realizes that there is a ceiling, and it does not get easier to obtain an undergraduate degree than it is if you're 20 and have already completed three years worth of the program.
- paxys 5y ago
  What is an "officer position"? I work at a large tech company (and have worked at several others, including Microsoft) and several of my directors, VPs and equivalent have had no formal degree. This is common when employees rise through the ranks or come in via acquisitions. Companies aren't going to ask for college transcripts when offering you a promotion. What matters is your experience and performance, that's it.
  - TameAntelope 5y ago
    A VP is an officer (a director is not), and I've worked with people who were asked for exactly those things when interviewing or being considered for such a promotion, both internally and interviewing for a role externally. I agree that what you say about experience and performance should be the only thing that matters, but it's naive to think that's simply "true", with no caveats, qualifications, or exceptions. I don't think it's as common as you think as you progress in your career beyond an individual contributor, generally in the tech industry, and specifically at Microsoft I'm 75% sure what you're saying is not the case, with a very small handful of exceptions.
    - zahllos 5y ago
      Another aspect to consider: this is all a very US-centric view. In the UK, getting hired without a degree is not impossible (I did it) but very difficult, and some processes will simply filter you out. Large employers like IBM want a 2.2 equivalent degree from a good-ish university, doesn't matter what, and you can potentially go and work for them. Even FAANG, those that are here, e.g. Google, Amazon, Facebook, will primarily recruit people with degrees. Ditching the degree will also make it harder to move abroad if you want to in the future, since most immigration formalities evaluate education level. This is definitely true when it comes to emigrating _into_ the US, for example. Also, if you ever decide you need to go back to university (school) to learn about something in the future, I don't know about the US, but in Europe, a condition of entry to masters programmes is always holding a bachelors degree. So if you have to go back to school here, likely you'll be going back to bachelors level. I don't even know how valuable your existing credits would be - I can tell you that they tend to expire in the EU. So, there are some consequences to this choice. I'm not judging, each to their own, but if it were me, I'd say life isn't a race and unless you are already sat on a potential unicorn and it 'has to be now' Bill-Gates-style, a couple more years while you finish your degree is nothing.

johntiger1 5y ago

If you have time, then why not do it later in life?