5 ms·

I don't know if I would go that far. University education usually involves a ton of general-education classes for the first two years: English, science, history

I don't know if I would go that far. University education usually involves a ton of general-education classes for the first two years: English, science, history, math, basic science, etc. High school quality is quite uneven in the US, so these classes are largely necessary, imho. Also, that's not to mention the many "pre-med" classes that medical schools require for applicants. Are high school kids going to take the organic chemistry, biochem, etc. necessary for med school?

fallingknife 5y ago
Ask any doctor you know if they ever use organic chemistry.
- learc83 5y ago
  Topics build on each other. The average working engineer designing circuit boards isn’t calculating the nth derivative of a function on a daily basis. That doesn’t mean that they didn’t need to understand calculus as a prerequisite to other classes where they did learn skills they use frequently. MDs also aren’t technicians, they are a self regulating group of professionals with a high degree of legally protected autonomy and authority. Individually they make life or death decisions more frequently than anyone else. And as a group they make up regulatory bodies that impact everyone’s medical care. Like lawyers they have a very disproportionate impact on society. I think some amount of general education and general science background is appropriate.
dagw 5y ago
Are high school kids going to take the organic chemistry, biochem, etc. necessary for med school? Why can't med school teach all the classes needed for med school?
- learc83 5y ago
  1. Med school is a lot more expensive than undergraduate education. 2. Making a decent grade in those classes at an accredited school is a good filter. 3. MDs aren’t just technicians. They are leaders, managers, and ethicists. They have a higher level of legally protected autonomy than nearly any other profession. Given that, I think that 2 years of general education is appropriate. For the same reasons I think general education is appropriate for other professions with a high degree of autonomy, authority, and impact, e.g., civil engineers, lawyers, and teachers (all the teachers reading this are laughing at the autonomy part).
nicoburns 5y ago
> Are high school kids going to take the organic chemistry, biochem, etc. necessary for med school? Due to the competitiveness of getting a place on a medicine course, it's pretty much impossible to get into a medicine degree here in the UK without having taken Physics, Chemistry and Biology at A-level, and maybe maths too. So... yes. Note also: medical degrees are longer than other degrees in Europe (5 years instead of the standard 3 here in the UK). But you go directly into a specialised medicine course. I think you can do a graduate medicine degree in 4 years if you have an undergraduate degree in a related field, but that's relatively uncommon.

fallingknife 5y ago

Ask any doctor you know if they ever use organic chemistry.

learc83 5y ago
Topics build on each other. The average working engineer designing circuit boards isn’t calculating the nth derivative of a function on a daily basis. That doesn’t mean that they didn’t need to understand calculus as a prerequisite to other classes where they did learn skills they use frequently. MDs also aren’t technicians, they are a self regulating group of professionals with a high degree of legally protected autonomy and authority. Individually they make life or death decisions more frequently than anyone else. And as a group they make up regulatory bodies that impact everyone’s medical care. Like lawyers they have a very disproportionate impact on society. I think some amount of general education and general science background is appropriate.

dagw 5y ago

Are high school kids going to take the organic chemistry, biochem, etc. necessary for med school? Why can't med school teach all the classes needed for med school?

learc83 5y ago
1. Med school is a lot more expensive than undergraduate education. 2. Making a decent grade in those classes at an accredited school is a good filter. 3. MDs aren’t just technicians. They are leaders, managers, and ethicists. They have a higher level of legally protected autonomy than nearly any other profession. Given that, I think that 2 years of general education is appropriate. For the same reasons I think general education is appropriate for other professions with a high degree of autonomy, authority, and impact, e.g., civil engineers, lawyers, and teachers (all the teachers reading this are laughing at the autonomy part).

nicoburns 5y ago

> Are high school kids going to take the organic chemistry, biochem, etc. necessary for med school? Due to the competitiveness of getting a place on a medicine course, it's pretty much impossible to get into a medicine degree here in the UK without having taken Physics, Chemistry and Biology at A-level, and maybe maths too. So... yes. Note also: medical degrees are longer than other degrees in Europe (5 years instead of the standard 3 here in the UK). But you go directly into a specialised medicine course. I think you can do a graduate medicine degree in 4 years if you have an undergraduate degree in a related field, but that's relatively uncommon.