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Sure. It's a big subject but here's my take: IQ, first off, does not measure intelligence. Intelligence is qualititative, like beauty, not quantitative like h
by david927 15y ago
Sure. It's a big subject but here's my take: IQ, first off, does not measure intelligence. Intelligence is qualititative, like beauty, not quantitative like height. While you can be one inch taller than someone else, you can't be one point prettier. You can measure cheekbones in women, and higher cheekbones will on average indicate "more beautiful". You can say, Czech women have higher cheekbones on average than other nationalities and as a country, it tends to produce more super models per capita, and draw some correlation. IQ can be used this way too, but it's measuring aspect associatied with intelligence, not intelligence. Worse, for years there was an understanding that IQ can't be changed per person, leading us to believe we are 'this' smart and can't get smarter. What a fiasco because we now know that it's like fitness in this regard: The more you work at it, the smarter you can become.
Dr. Kay mentions outlook and that does apply. This beauty analogy is important, so let's keep using it. My wife and I were in Monaco yesterday, and two women passed us who had clearly undergone tremendous amounts of plastic surgery; and we agreed that it made them look hideous. If there was a Beauty Quotient (BQ), they would proudly declare themselves to have "a high BQ". It simply doesn't work that way. Take any public figure you find beautiful and look at their feature set. You'll find it's not a simple addition of beauty features that makes them beautiful. It's about the mix of features -- for that time and culture. In other words, it's partly about "character" (what Kay calls "outlook"). But while that's where it ends for beauty, that's only where it starts for intelligence. Because your character, how you define yourself, will block your ability to make the right connections. If you think of yourself as a patriot, you will block information that will run contrary to that belief. If you define yourself as being smart, you won't be able to accept conclusions that might be contraversial and place that image in doubt, and so you will be less intelligent for it.
Dr. Kay calls knowledge important. It is, but not as much as he thinks. If we consider Graph Theory, we can say "knowledge" is like the vertices -- the dots. When learning you group dots and break apart dots: ascern (my word) and discern. Ascern means finding common properties in group of data points: wine and water are both part of the set of liquids. Discern means distinguishing differences: wine can be red or white, and red wine can be from different grapes such as merlot, pinot noir, etc.
"Understanding" is the equivalent of the edges -- the lines connecting the dots (of various abstraction levels). You can't understand what you don't know, so you need knowledge, but that alone won't get you there. In fact, too much knowledge in any particular space can inhibit your ability to draw inferences and truly 'understand' the subject (making relations amount the data points) because you're dealing with information in terms of too small of data points; you're not abstracting high enough. The edges are not as simple as I'm making them out to be. The edges actually say, this applies to that 'usually' and 'in certain cases'. Water belongs to the set of liquids, but only when the temperature is right. So these data points are abstracted via edges, and so, in conditional ways.
Understanding also means knowing at a comfort level that allows you to play with the information at the right abstraction level. Let's say you are air-dropped into New York City. All you know is what you've heard about Central Park and the Empire State Building. So what you do, initially, is to abstract around those landmarks. Where is the really good Thai restaurant? A bit to the South-West of Central Park. But as you learn more about NYC, you get more detailed: the place is next to the Roxy on Lex and 23rd. You're able to talk in terms of greater granualarity: What are the bad areas? At first they will be big swaths of areas of NYC, but later more and more like little bubbles throughout the city. Sorry, that's not a good explanation at all -- I'll try to come up with something better. The main thing is that "understanding" lets you create verticies when you don't have them (via approximation to other edges and vertices), and use unknowns with more ease. If you don't "understand", you will cling more tightly to your landmarks, but when you understand, you don't have to anymore.
We often call understanding about life "wisdom". We don't have a word for understand about cars and microbiology. And it's this understanding combined with character, where true intelligence or genius arises.
- barrkel 15y agoI think you've redefined the words intelligence and knowledge to mean things other than what Kay and others use them to mean. If you use a private language, it's easy to win any argument. I don't disagree that there are useful distinctions to be made between facts, concepts and wisdom; but I used the word knowledge to encompass all three. I strongly disagree with you that "true intelligence" (a true Scotsman?) is a synonym for genius; both words would be hopelessly ambiguous in meaning if that were the case; and I also disagree that understanding is required for intelligence. Rather, some intelligence is a prerequisite for understanding, and to some degree intelligence is a measure of the rate of change of understanding when presented with novel situations - the first derivative, if you will. If you meet someone who is quick on the uptake, who learns quickly; and contrast them with someone a bit slow; what are you to call that quality of them if not intelligence? This quality is not reliant on character or understanding, but rather the reverse. And I still think that if you use the words as Kay meant them, you would not disagree with him. All the more so, since you emphasize the synergy between understanding and smarts.
- david927 15y agoWait -- no one is trying to win an argument. I must not be communicating my point well, so I apologize. If you meet someone who is quick on the uptake, who learns quickly; and contrast them with someone a bit slow; what are you to call that quality of them if not intelligence? I would call that "quick uptake" and "a bit slow." That's it. Einstein learned to talk at 5. So he was stupid? This is a poor way to define intelligence. When Dr. Kay says IQ, he also means this "innate cleverness." And my response is that if two people lift weights, one has to work at it more than the other, but both can lift the same weight, which one is stronger? Neither. They're equally strong. Mental acuity is very much like physical strength: it is what you make it. So, I say, it makes no sense to define a predisposition to mental acuity, since that is impossible to define, is easily misunderstood and doesn't reflect the end reality. I'm not switching terms on this: it's a useless, and potentially harmful, distinction. And I still think that if you use the words as Kay meant them, you would not disagree with him. I think that knowledge is a basis for intelligence but not as important as Dr. Kay asserts. For me, knowledge, in-and-of-itself is only the vertices upon which to build the graph of true understanding. How that graph is built is fascinating and I think deserves more examination, which is why we can't leave it a single term called "outlook," in my opinion. But that's just my opinion; I'm not trying to win points or arguments. Further, Dr. Kay's goal was not to give a lecture on intelligence, but to get the audience to think harder about what they value. Which is incredibly important and is just one of the reasons he's a hero of mine.