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Your first sentence is pure speculation, and was refuted by French officials. The second sentence is just hyperbole. I’m sure you can do better!

google234123 5y ago
https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/new-pressures-emerge-in-french-submarine-fight-20210513-p57rid https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/new-pressures-emerge-in... (from may) https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/call-to-review-submarine-program-over-tensions-20210118-p56ux0 https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/call-to-review-submarin... (Jan) mentions walking away. Doubling the price, delays, and changing the terms (reducing local contribution told from 90 to less than 60) aren’t good ways to secure a deal with a partner that was already angry in 2018.
- sofixa 5y ago
  They were aware there were issues, and negotiations happened on how to fix them, with the French leaving them with the impression everything is good. Meanwhile Australia was already negotiating an alternative deal.
  - corty 5y ago
    > They were aware there were issues, and negotiations happened on how to fix them, with the French leaving them with the impression everything is good. The French culture is to never deliver bad news before the deadline has arrived. Underlings will never tell their boss that something is impossible, decisions will be made by grande-ecole-bosses without technical expertise and relationships are valued far higher than knowledge and expertise. You'll always get the first impression that all is well and they'll manage before the deadline. If you need a real non-sugar-coated insight as to how the project is going you need to gather your own data. Discreetly. However, as soon as shit has hit the fan and bosses got involved, they'll bend over backwards to make things work. But you cannot expect meeting the first deadline, ever. Same for the first budget. Subsequent ones depend on the size of the project.
    - WastingMyTime89 5y ago
      > The French culture is to never deliver bad news before the deadline has arrived. No, it definitely is not. You have no idea of how this kind of project works. Naval Group has a ton of experience managing large contracts with state actors. They have worked with Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Singapore, Taiwan, Pakistan, India, Malaysia, Egypt and I am probably forgetting some. They know what they are doing.

google234123 5y ago

https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/new-pressures-emerge-in-french-submarine-fight-20210513-p57rid https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/new-pressures-emerge-in... (from may) https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/call-to-review-submarine-program-over-tensions-20210118-p56ux0 https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/call-to-review-submarin... (Jan) mentions walking away. Doubling the price, delays, and changing the terms (reducing local contribution told from 90 to less than 60) aren’t good ways to secure a deal with a partner that was already angry in 2018.

sofixa 5y ago
They were aware there were issues, and negotiations happened on how to fix them, with the French leaving them with the impression everything is good. Meanwhile Australia was already negotiating an alternative deal.
- corty 5y ago
  > They were aware there were issues, and negotiations happened on how to fix them, with the French leaving them with the impression everything is good. The French culture is to never deliver bad news before the deadline has arrived. Underlings will never tell their boss that something is impossible, decisions will be made by grande-ecole-bosses without technical expertise and relationships are valued far higher than knowledge and expertise. You'll always get the first impression that all is well and they'll manage before the deadline. If you need a real non-sugar-coated insight as to how the project is going you need to gather your own data. Discreetly. However, as soon as shit has hit the fan and bosses got involved, they'll bend over backwards to make things work. But you cannot expect meeting the first deadline, ever. Same for the first budget. Subsequent ones depend on the size of the project.
  - WastingMyTime89 5y ago
    > The French culture is to never deliver bad news before the deadline has arrived. No, it definitely is not. You have no idea of how this kind of project works. Naval Group has a ton of experience managing large contracts with state actors. They have worked with Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Singapore, Taiwan, Pakistan, India, Malaysia, Egypt and I am probably forgetting some. They know what they are doing.