4 ms·

I have a hard time seeing most of these as "emergent narrative". They're just random level generation. By that metric Asteroids is "emergent narrative". 5 astr

I have a hard time seeing most of these as "emergent narrative". They're just random level generation. By that metric Asteroids is "emergent narrative". 5 astroids approached, 2 from the left, one from the top, 2 from the right. I decided to target the one on the top. It broke in 2 but my quick reflexes swiftly took care of the one heading toward me. I gave chase to the other clearing the universe of one of its original 5 asteroids." To have "emergent narrative" IMO requires a much larger set of verbs than "door, lock, hallway, monsters types A-Z, etc..."

bryan0 5y ago
I totally agree. These are emergent settings. Setting is one small part of a narrative. I feel like this actually was a goal game developers were trying to hit in the 90s and there really hasn’t been much progress…
stubish 5y ago
I tend to agree. The choice to label this as narrative is a mind trick. A when a procedurally generated level spits out something completely bizarre and game breaking, you have a laugh at the developer and maybe file a bug report. When generated narrative is completely bizarre and game breaking, you engage with the unique experience and see where it leads. When a game has a poor story, you wish they bothered to employ a writer and not just graphics programmers. When a game has so little story it forces you to make it up yourself, you have to replace it with your imagination. Personally, I think most emergent narratives are poor narratives. They lack the pacing and dynamics of one crafted by a story teller. I think Rimworld tackled this, with the different 'storyteller' options selecting certain types of events, levels of difficulty etc., trying to improve the sense of drama. But it is still stuck with poor choices making poor narratives. "So I made my pickaxe and tunnelled through the wall the noises were coming from and was eaten. The end.'
- thewakalix 5y ago
  > When a game has a poor story, you wish they bothered to employ a writer and not just graphics programmers. At least this criticism can’t apply to Dwarf Fortress — IBM VGA-9 makes for some pretty cheap graphics!
strogonoff 5y ago
Emergent narratives of the kind one might encounter in, say, Dwarf Fortress arise due to a combination of a (1) procedurally generated world in its early state with the necessary component of (2) ages upon ages of procedurally generated history applied on top of it. The element of time past makes for a stark difference from other uses of randomness or procedural generation. By the time the world arrives in its “current” state where player-controlled characters enter, the long, complex, infeasible to study in detail history (which, by the way, involves said characters and their ancestors) imbues everything with potential meaning and significance.

bryan0 5y ago

I totally agree. These are emergent settings. Setting is one small part of a narrative. I feel like this actually was a goal game developers were trying to hit in the 90s and there really hasn’t been much progress…

stubish 5y ago

I tend to agree. The choice to label this as narrative is a mind trick. A when a procedurally generated level spits out something completely bizarre and game breaking, you have a laugh at the developer and maybe file a bug report. When generated narrative is completely bizarre and game breaking, you engage with the unique experience and see where it leads. When a game has a poor story, you wish they bothered to employ a writer and not just graphics programmers. When a game has so little story it forces you to make it up yourself, you have to replace it with your imagination. Personally, I think most emergent narratives are poor narratives. They lack the pacing and dynamics of one crafted by a story teller. I think Rimworld tackled this, with the different 'storyteller' options selecting certain types of events, levels of difficulty etc., trying to improve the sense of drama. But it is still stuck with poor choices making poor narratives. "So I made my pickaxe and tunnelled through the wall the noises were coming from and was eaten. The end.'

thewakalix 5y ago
> When a game has a poor story, you wish they bothered to employ a writer and not just graphics programmers. At least this criticism can’t apply to Dwarf Fortress — IBM VGA-9 makes for some pretty cheap graphics!

strogonoff 5y ago

Emergent narratives of the kind one might encounter in, say, Dwarf Fortress arise due to a combination of a (1) procedurally generated world in its early state with the necessary component of (2) ages upon ages of procedurally generated history applied on top of it. The element of time past makes for a stark difference from other uses of randomness or procedural generation. By the time the world arrives in its “current” state where player-controlled characters enter, the long, complex, infeasible to study in detail history (which, by the way, involves said characters and their ancestors) imbues everything with potential meaning and significance.