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Pattern #1: Don't politicize the pandemic. Pattern #2: Enforce mask mandates Pattern #3: terminate public officials who won't enforce immediately I'd say somet

Pattern #1: Don't politicize the pandemic. Pattern #2: Enforce mask mandates Pattern #3: terminate public officials who won't enforce immediately I'd say something about vaccines as well but I don't want to trigger the engineer epidemiologist demographic they are very fragile. But, you know, Israel (not an island nation even).

taeric 5y ago
While I agree with those points, my understanding is that the evidence is actually rather thin right now. About the only pattern that has consistently played out, is nations getting cocky and then getting smashed. And this doesn't address the end game. Vaccines are about the only route that makes sense. The rest seems to be akin to thinking condoms alone could solve STDs. They definitely help. They aren't getting is to the end, though.
- varelse 5y ago
  Condoms bought time to come up with a treatment for HIV in the same way that masks bought time for us to arrive at vaccines, no?
  - taeric 5y ago
    I mean... Maybe? I don't think I ever saw evidence that they moved that needle. And to your previous point, a ton of damage came from politicizing the issue.
    - varelse 5y ago
      https://www.aidsmap.com/about-hiv/do-condoms-work https://www.aidsmap.com/about-hiv/do-condoms-work
      - taeric 5y ago
        I'm not sure what you are getting at with posting that. Of course condoms work when used properly. Problem is that there is a high rate of not getting used properly, such that I'm not clear on how effective that is as a policy. The very first key takeaway is "Laboratory testing shows that condoms are impermeable to viruses, but protection rates are lower in real-world studies." Seeming to support my "maybe?" That is, I did not intend my "maybe" to cover the question of if condoms can do what they are designed to do. I meant that I wasn't aware of any studies showing how effective they are as a policy. And again, to your point, there are plenty of places where these are taken off the table as a policy, out of some misguided sense of propriety for the population. Please do not take my point as one that is against the use.
        varelse 5y ago
        If one cannot figure out how condoms work, I'm hoping they can't figure out the rest either lest they reproduce, but that's probably unrealistically optimistic.
        taeric 5y ago
        Other confounders will be that other contact can also spread some diseases. Such that they didn't get things from sex, but still spread. Though, again, my question is of how much it helps. I cede and expect that it helps. Some or a lot, though? And, in either case, what gets it to contained? And I fully acknowledge that my opening "maybe" wasn't as clear on that as it could have been. My intent was to push back on forgone conclusions without hard data.
8note 5y ago
Pandemic response is policies. That's directly political. The problem is that various countries' (USA in particular) political institutions are in crises and facing collapse. So instead, the pattern instead, is embrace authoritarian politics and do what's dictated to you unquestioningly.

taeric 5y ago

While I agree with those points, my understanding is that the evidence is actually rather thin right now. About the only pattern that has consistently played out, is nations getting cocky and then getting smashed. And this doesn't address the end game. Vaccines are about the only route that makes sense. The rest seems to be akin to thinking condoms alone could solve STDs. They definitely help. They aren't getting is to the end, though.

varelse 5y ago
Condoms bought time to come up with a treatment for HIV in the same way that masks bought time for us to arrive at vaccines, no?
- taeric 5y ago
  I mean... Maybe? I don't think I ever saw evidence that they moved that needle. And to your previous point, a ton of damage came from politicizing the issue.
  - varelse 5y ago
    https://www.aidsmap.com/about-hiv/do-condoms-work https://www.aidsmap.com/about-hiv/do-condoms-work
    - taeric 5y ago
      I'm not sure what you are getting at with posting that. Of course condoms work when used properly. Problem is that there is a high rate of not getting used properly, such that I'm not clear on how effective that is as a policy. The very first key takeaway is "Laboratory testing shows that condoms are impermeable to viruses, but protection rates are lower in real-world studies." Seeming to support my "maybe?" That is, I did not intend my "maybe" to cover the question of if condoms can do what they are designed to do. I meant that I wasn't aware of any studies showing how effective they are as a policy. And again, to your point, there are plenty of places where these are taken off the table as a policy, out of some misguided sense of propriety for the population. Please do not take my point as one that is against the use.
      - varelse 5y ago
        If one cannot figure out how condoms work, I'm hoping they can't figure out the rest either lest they reproduce, but that's probably unrealistically optimistic.
        taeric 5y ago
        Other confounders will be that other contact can also spread some diseases. Such that they didn't get things from sex, but still spread. Though, again, my question is of how much it helps. I cede and expect that it helps. Some or a lot, though? And, in either case, what gets it to contained? And I fully acknowledge that my opening "maybe" wasn't as clear on that as it could have been. My intent was to push back on forgone conclusions without hard data.

8note 5y ago

Pandemic response is policies. That's directly political. The problem is that various countries' (USA in particular) political institutions are in crises and facing collapse. So instead, the pattern instead, is embrace authoritarian politics and do what's dictated to you unquestioningly.