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> We less rich folks only get what we want, to the extent we do, because these elites mostly agree with us, and because we sometimes influence mass interest gr

> We less rich folks only get what we want, to the extent we do, because these elites mostly agree with us, and because we sometimes influence mass interest groups. The Cambridge Princeton study found the same thing. When "less rich folks" get what they want, it was only because of coincidence with something elites were already pursuing, with sometimes there being mass influence of what the elites were doing, but never really influence of the agencies heads or representatives. And so there is neither direct democracy (which, duh, but people act like there is at the federal level), nor is there representative democracy unless you elevate an amorphous group of "elites" as the idea of representatives.

h2odragon 5y ago
Go hang out at some fundraiser dinners and other places politicians, specifically the kind of things that federal congresscritters, state representatives and governors speak at. Bring a camera and write a blog post about it and they'll often let you in as a journalist for free, and might even feed you. We do have a representative democracy, and a shockingly effective one. It represents the people who can drop $50k + annually on political donations. My time in that world is some time in the past so I'm probably badly underestimating the amount. Not that these elected representatives don't consider the actual constituents and citizenry, but they listen to their donor list. With all the goodwill and the best people having the best intentions, the system would still have flaws; and these people are just people like the rest of us.
- vmception 5y ago
  > We do have a representative democracy, and a shockingly effective one. It represents the people who can drop $50k + annually on political donations. My time in that world is some time in the past so I'm probably badly underestimating the amount. Ha! Yes this is true. I don't find this controversial, I find it sad that poorer people were lied to about their ability to participate or what the vote means or its weight.

h2odragon 5y ago

Go hang out at some fundraiser dinners and other places politicians, specifically the kind of things that federal congresscritters, state representatives and governors speak at. Bring a camera and write a blog post about it and they'll often let you in as a journalist for free, and might even feed you. We do have a representative democracy, and a shockingly effective one. It represents the people who can drop $50k + annually on political donations. My time in that world is some time in the past so I'm probably badly underestimating the amount. Not that these elected representatives don't consider the actual constituents and citizenry, but they listen to their donor list. With all the goodwill and the best people having the best intentions, the system would still have flaws; and these people are just people like the rest of us.

vmception 5y ago
> We do have a representative democracy, and a shockingly effective one. It represents the people who can drop $50k + annually on political donations. My time in that world is some time in the past so I'm probably badly underestimating the amount. Ha! Yes this is true. I don't find this controversial, I find it sad that poorer people were lied to about their ability to participate or what the vote means or its weight.