3 ms·

You have these "silent days" in most countries. When we have elections in France, we just look at Belgian or Swiss newspapers to see how the votes are going on.

You have these "silent days" in most countries. When we have elections in France, we just look at Belgian or Swiss newspapers to see how the votes are going on. They do not care about these days, only French newspapers and media do. Twitter does not, Facebook does not, Telegram does not - nobody cares except for France. How is Russia different?

akho 5y ago
You either believe that this regulation makes sense, or you don’t. France, apparently, is in a situation where nobody cares enough to enforce, but taking the law off the books is not politically feasible. I do not know whether that’s a good thing. As a Russian: the election has a limited relevance beyond a certain type of signaling. The majority of United Russia is largely guaranteed by the “electoral sultanates”, so votes cast now will not impact new legislation over the next five years. If your purpose is to signal things, being morally clean is more important than the number of votes you manage to achieve. If a law is reasonable, and a norm in multiple other well-regarded systems, it makes sense to comply.
- thriftwy 5y ago
  It could still allow for a few independent-ish senators via single mandate district system. If it is allowed to run fairly at least in some locales. Source: observing one.
  - akho 5y ago
    Sure. How does this relate to the very late publishing of lists? Or to complying with “silent days”?
    - thriftwy 5y ago
      It doesn't. Merely a comment towards the state of electoral affairs.
- BrandoElFollito 5y ago
  > France, apparently, is in a situation where nobody cares enough to enforce It is strictly enforced in France. But Internet knows no borders so the statistics of votes (which is is illegal to provide in France during the voting day) are available outside of France (usually in French speaking Belgian / Swiss online newspapers, or Twitter/FB/...). My point is that a country cannot expect that other countries (and services in these countries) will follow their rules. > If your purpose is to signal things, being morally clean is more important than the number of votes you manage to achieve. If a law is reasonable, and a norm in multiple other well-regarded systems, it makes sense to comply. I am not sure I understand that point.
  - akho 5y ago
    > It is strictly enforced in France It’s not strictly enforced. Exit polls published outside France are collected inside France. Those who collect with clear intent to immediately publish are subject to French law, and may be fined. Which, from what you are saying, does not happen. > I am not sure I understand that point I am not sure how to explain it better. You should not both demand lawful election and circumvent electoral laws at the same time. You can, and people do, but it’s not a strong position.
    - BrandoElFollito 5y ago
      > Those who collect with clear intent to immediately publish are subject to French law, and may be fined Exit polls are legal. Publishing them is not. They are published by non-French entities, which cannot be fined because of some internal law of ours. > You should not both demand lawful election and circumvent electoral laws at the same time. You can, and people do, but it’s not a strong position The rules are from the times where information was provided by printed newspapers, radio and TV. It is time to realize that we are in a different world and adapt. If we allow foreign newspapers to publish data (because we cannot forbid that), we should give an equal chance to the French ones.
Aissen 5y ago
Hmm, I've been wondering the same, and I'm not sure this applies here. They clearly used other legal means (marking the org as terrorist). If you have a leaflet already at home, you can still read it. If you walk to your local party's branch, you can read the leaflets there. Websites of most parties do not close during silent days, only advertisement is forbidden. Finally, this Smart Voting app does not seem to use any real-time polling result, does it? It's basically a directory with local candidates per area.
- BrandoElFollito 5y ago
  What I meant is essence is that moving the information outside the country to an entity that is independent (and cannot be bullied like Apple or Google were) would allow for access to that information (the dynamic part (the part of the information that changes) is interesting because, as you noted, once you have it, you have it)
- akho 5y ago
  The government used the ‘extremist’ classification, yes. Telegram’s Durov referred to the ‘silent days’ practice as his excuse.

akho 5y ago

You either believe that this regulation makes sense, or you don’t. France, apparently, is in a situation where nobody cares enough to enforce, but taking the law off the books is not politically feasible. I do not know whether that’s a good thing. As a Russian: the election has a limited relevance beyond a certain type of signaling. The majority of United Russia is largely guaranteed by the “electoral sultanates”, so votes cast now will not impact new legislation over the next five years. If your purpose is to signal things, being morally clean is more important than the number of votes you manage to achieve. If a law is reasonable, and a norm in multiple other well-regarded systems, it makes sense to comply.

thriftwy 5y ago
It could still allow for a few independent-ish senators via single mandate district system. If it is allowed to run fairly at least in some locales. Source: observing one.
- akho 5y ago
  Sure. How does this relate to the very late publishing of lists? Or to complying with “silent days”?
  - thriftwy 5y ago
    It doesn't. Merely a comment towards the state of electoral affairs.
BrandoElFollito 5y ago
> France, apparently, is in a situation where nobody cares enough to enforce It is strictly enforced in France. But Internet knows no borders so the statistics of votes (which is is illegal to provide in France during the voting day) are available outside of France (usually in French speaking Belgian / Swiss online newspapers, or Twitter/FB/...). My point is that a country cannot expect that other countries (and services in these countries) will follow their rules. > If your purpose is to signal things, being morally clean is more important than the number of votes you manage to achieve. If a law is reasonable, and a norm in multiple other well-regarded systems, it makes sense to comply. I am not sure I understand that point.
- akho 5y ago
  > It is strictly enforced in France It’s not strictly enforced. Exit polls published outside France are collected inside France. Those who collect with clear intent to immediately publish are subject to French law, and may be fined. Which, from what you are saying, does not happen. > I am not sure I understand that point I am not sure how to explain it better. You should not both demand lawful election and circumvent electoral laws at the same time. You can, and people do, but it’s not a strong position.
  - BrandoElFollito 5y ago
    > Those who collect with clear intent to immediately publish are subject to French law, and may be fined Exit polls are legal. Publishing them is not. They are published by non-French entities, which cannot be fined because of some internal law of ours. > You should not both demand lawful election and circumvent electoral laws at the same time. You can, and people do, but it’s not a strong position The rules are from the times where information was provided by printed newspapers, radio and TV. It is time to realize that we are in a different world and adapt. If we allow foreign newspapers to publish data (because we cannot forbid that), we should give an equal chance to the French ones.

Aissen 5y ago

Hmm, I've been wondering the same, and I'm not sure this applies here. They clearly used other legal means (marking the org as terrorist). If you have a leaflet already at home, you can still read it. If you walk to your local party's branch, you can read the leaflets there. Websites of most parties do not close during silent days, only advertisement is forbidden. Finally, this Smart Voting app does not seem to use any real-time polling result, does it? It's basically a directory with local candidates per area.

BrandoElFollito 5y ago
What I meant is essence is that moving the information outside the country to an entity that is independent (and cannot be bullied like Apple or Google were) would allow for access to that information (the dynamic part (the part of the information that changes) is interesting because, as you noted, once you have it, you have it)
akho 5y ago
The government used the ‘extremist’ classification, yes. Telegram’s Durov referred to the ‘silent days’ practice as his excuse.