5 ms·

Why isn't the public allowed to make its own determination about what medical care they want to receive or reject? I would like the freedom to be able to purcha

Why isn't the public allowed to make its own determination about what medical care they want to receive or reject? I would like the freedom to be able to purchase a booster shot at the market price if I so choose. That's a voluntary transaction between me and the manufacturer and I do not agree with the FDA standing in the way. Is safety really a concern? Or is this more of a political decision to reserve vaccine doses for other countries per the WHO's request?

DoreenMichele 5y ago
Personal choices that have the ability to significantly negatively impact many other people have something of a tendency to get regulated and controlled in some manner. That's reality and it's not unreasonable. The thing we need to sort out is where to draw those lines to optimize for best outcomes for both individuals and society.
- psychlops 5y ago
  Nicely worded and I completely agree. For better or worse, individual choice is being bludgeoned to death by today's irrational zero risk mentality.
  - DoreenMichele 5y ago
    It's an especially thorny issue for medical stuff because if you insist that all people do X and for some people that makes them sicker, you haven't actually achieved zero risk. You've just traded one sickness for another and maybe that's even worse.
outside1234 5y ago
I think that's still possible - there just wasn't data that it is necessary for the under 65 yet.
throaway46546 5y ago
Is anyone stopping you? Can't you just make an appointment at a vaccine site? They aren't even checking ID. I know people who have already gotten boosters.
prox 5y ago
As long as there isn’t a surplus, I doubt that will happen.
EamonnMR 5y ago
Same argument against letting the general public administer care of their choice-Health Insurance does not want to pay for mistakes. Doctors are entrusted with making these decisions.
loeg 5y ago
For now, the market price for individuals is infinity. All the doses are being sold to governments.
AdrianB1 5y ago
There are 2 reasons: 1. Most don't have the knowledge to make an informed choice (how many people have enough medical knowledge?) 2. It is generally accepted that seat belts are mandatory, helmets on motorcycles are mandatory in most of the world (except a few states in US), but that is not seen as lack of own determination. What is the difference? All these are preventive actions.
- kaczordon 5y ago
  Most don't have the knowledge to make an informed choice (how many people have enough medical knowledge?) You could say this about anything: camera lenses, frozen food, airline flights. How much do you really know about how these things operate/are made? Prices externalize that information that allows people to decide whether it’s worth it. Also most people are far smarter (especially when it regards their own bodies) than the assumption you’re making here…
  - AdrianB1 5y ago
    You can buy the wrong DSRL or smartphone, but not take the wrong drugs. Self-medication is one of the top causes of death in some countries, bad purchases of electronic devices or vacations is not.
    - perl4ever 5y ago
      Professional medical treatment is estimated to be the third leading cause of death in the US, behind heart disease and cancer. Johns Hopkins did a study on it. 250,000 people a year. Nearly 10% of all deaths. A 0.7% chance of dying (from a mistake) per hospital visit. You know why it goes under the radar? Because there is no billing code for f-ups. I realize of course this doesn't mean self-medication is safer; legitimate medical treatment might cause more deaths just because there is more of it. [https://hub.jhu.edu/2016/05/03/medical-errors-third-leading-cause-of-death/ https://hub.jhu.edu/2016/05/03/medical-errors-third-leading-...] "The researchers caution that most medical errors aren't due to inherently bad doctors, and that reporting these errors shouldn't be addressed by punishment or legal action. Rather, they say, most errors represent systemic problems, including poorly coordinated care, fragmented insurance networks, the absence or underuse of safety nets, and other protocols, in addition to unwarranted variation in physician practice patterns that lack accountability."
grillvogel 5y ago
by that logic i should be able to go buy myself a big box of fentanyl for the medical care i've decided that i need
- akomtu 5y ago
  What's wrong with it? It's your body after all.
  - grillvogel 5y ago
    so you are against doctors and prescriptions?
    - akomtu 5y ago
      You can consult with a doctor, just like you can consult with a lawyer or a HVAC specialist, but the ultimate decision is yours because you bear all the risk.

DoreenMichele 5y ago

Personal choices that have the ability to significantly negatively impact many other people have something of a tendency to get regulated and controlled in some manner. That's reality and it's not unreasonable. The thing we need to sort out is where to draw those lines to optimize for best outcomes for both individuals and society.

psychlops 5y ago
Nicely worded and I completely agree. For better or worse, individual choice is being bludgeoned to death by today's irrational zero risk mentality.
- DoreenMichele 5y ago
  It's an especially thorny issue for medical stuff because if you insist that all people do X and for some people that makes them sicker, you haven't actually achieved zero risk. You've just traded one sickness for another and maybe that's even worse.

outside1234 5y ago

I think that's still possible - there just wasn't data that it is necessary for the under 65 yet.

throaway46546 5y ago

Is anyone stopping you? Can't you just make an appointment at a vaccine site? They aren't even checking ID. I know people who have already gotten boosters.

prox 5y ago

As long as there isn’t a surplus, I doubt that will happen.

EamonnMR 5y ago

Same argument against letting the general public administer care of their choice-Health Insurance does not want to pay for mistakes. Doctors are entrusted with making these decisions.

loeg 5y ago

For now, the market price for individuals is infinity. All the doses are being sold to governments.

AdrianB1 5y ago

There are 2 reasons: 1. Most don't have the knowledge to make an informed choice (how many people have enough medical knowledge?) 2. It is generally accepted that seat belts are mandatory, helmets on motorcycles are mandatory in most of the world (except a few states in US), but that is not seen as lack of own determination. What is the difference? All these are preventive actions.

kaczordon 5y ago
Most don't have the knowledge to make an informed choice (how many people have enough medical knowledge?) You could say this about anything: camera lenses, frozen food, airline flights. How much do you really know about how these things operate/are made? Prices externalize that information that allows people to decide whether it’s worth it. Also most people are far smarter (especially when it regards their own bodies) than the assumption you’re making here…
- AdrianB1 5y ago
  You can buy the wrong DSRL or smartphone, but not take the wrong drugs. Self-medication is one of the top causes of death in some countries, bad purchases of electronic devices or vacations is not.
  - perl4ever 5y ago
    Professional medical treatment is estimated to be the third leading cause of death in the US, behind heart disease and cancer. Johns Hopkins did a study on it. 250,000 people a year. Nearly 10% of all deaths. A 0.7% chance of dying (from a mistake) per hospital visit. You know why it goes under the radar? Because there is no billing code for f-ups. I realize of course this doesn't mean self-medication is safer; legitimate medical treatment might cause more deaths just because there is more of it. [https://hub.jhu.edu/2016/05/03/medical-errors-third-leading-cause-of-death/ https://hub.jhu.edu/2016/05/03/medical-errors-third-leading-...] "The researchers caution that most medical errors aren't due to inherently bad doctors, and that reporting these errors shouldn't be addressed by punishment or legal action. Rather, they say, most errors represent systemic problems, including poorly coordinated care, fragmented insurance networks, the absence or underuse of safety nets, and other protocols, in addition to unwarranted variation in physician practice patterns that lack accountability."

grillvogel 5y ago

by that logic i should be able to go buy myself a big box of fentanyl for the medical care i've decided that i need

akomtu 5y ago
What's wrong with it? It's your body after all.
- grillvogel 5y ago
  so you are against doctors and prescriptions?
  - akomtu 5y ago
    You can consult with a doctor, just like you can consult with a lawyer or a HVAC specialist, but the ultimate decision is yours because you bear all the risk.