4 ms·

Even if you strung fiber to every home, you still need to get the internet to your area. I looked at some major carriers maps, and it looks like you are going

by mike_d 5y ago

Even if you strung fiber to every home, you still need to get the internet to your area. I looked at some major carriers maps, and it looks like you are going to need to trench at least 25-30 miles of fiber along 502 and 84 to reach the Zayo fiber running along 25 south of Santa Fe. THe Nuclear Security Administration is in the process of laying a second fiber path to the lab up there, and while you have zero chance of piggy backing on a DoE fiber line the planning documents might be helpful in figuring out what is viable and what isn't. https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2020/04/f74/final-ea-2122-second-fiber-optic-circuit-route-LANL-2020-05.pdf https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/2020/04/f74/final... (Feel free to email me if you need further help, it is in my profile)

southerntofu 5y ago
I'm sure you're aware of that, but just in case other people are reading: getting uplinks to well-connected places is the easy part. You just need a little money (think 1-3k€/km) and a few authorizations to use public utilities or cross private land here and there. Laying the local loop is the hardest, most expensive part of the project because there's a lot more cable to lay, and you usually have to gather a lot more authorizations from different people/orgs.
- dc786 5y ago
  Factor in Indian Country. Not that simple.
  - southerntofu 5y ago
    Do you mean indigenous sovereign nation territories? Or Indian country as in India one of the most populated countries on Earth? I assume the former because the conversation was about USA in the first place. It is my understanding that US industry and law enforcement has exactly 0 respect for peace treaties with indigenous nations and their territorial sovereignty, especially when it comes to extracting natural resources. However, it's good if local communities care for respecting other people's lands. If your fiber needs to cross private property or indigenous reservations, i'd recommend having an honest discussion with their residents. Maybe some would actually like to have good connection as a public service (as the Rhizomatica project has been building mobile phone and internet infrastructure for some communities in another part of the world) but would be hostile to private for-profits ignoring their needs.
- mike_d 5y ago
  The average here in the US is $15,000 for 24 strand and $27,000 for burial per mile. However the area in question is full of historical areas and protected land that limits the fiber run to the most indirect path possible following a highway.
  - southerntofu 5y ago
    Wow, that's a lot of money. I must admit i don't know about commercial fiber deployment so these numbers blow my mind. But from what i saw for the costs in big french cities (where there are established underground networks to pass cables) and french countryside (where you just use a tractor to dig "for free" on the border of a peasant's field) that sounds very expensive. To my knowledge, all french highways and major railways are also already populated with fiber so you can just rent some point-to-point transit there from established operators without having to lay your own. Good luck with this project keep us updated
fraserphysics 5y ago
I think there is something called REDInet that runs up 84 to Taos. And I've heard that Los Alamos County has some kind of in with that new path. Also, I think Comcast and others piggy back on the existing link that DOE uses. Finally, I want the County to hire someone to stay on top of such issues.
dreamcompiler 5y ago
Not sure the chance is zero. Since Los Alamos is a company town, you might be able to convince NNSA that it's in their best interest to create a community network for LANL enployees. Jill Hruby (who runs NNSA) is a reasonable person and she's from New Mexico. Can't hurt to ask.
- fraserphysics 5y ago
  Asking for help from NNSA is exactly the kind of thing I hope the broadband manager will do. We need to find and hire the broadband manager first.

by mike_d 5y ago

southerntofu 5y ago

I'm sure you're aware of that, but just in case other people are reading: getting uplinks to well-connected places is the easy part. You just need a little money (think 1-3k€/km) and a few authorizations to use public utilities or cross private land here and there. Laying the local loop is the hardest, most expensive part of the project because there's a lot more cable to lay, and you usually have to gather a lot more authorizations from different people/orgs.

dc786 5y ago
Factor in Indian Country. Not that simple.
- southerntofu 5y ago
  Do you mean indigenous sovereign nation territories? Or Indian country as in India one of the most populated countries on Earth? I assume the former because the conversation was about USA in the first place. It is my understanding that US industry and law enforcement has exactly 0 respect for peace treaties with indigenous nations and their territorial sovereignty, especially when it comes to extracting natural resources. However, it's good if local communities care for respecting other people's lands. If your fiber needs to cross private property or indigenous reservations, i'd recommend having an honest discussion with their residents. Maybe some would actually like to have good connection as a public service (as the Rhizomatica project has been building mobile phone and internet infrastructure for some communities in another part of the world) but would be hostile to private for-profits ignoring their needs.
mike_d 5y ago
The average here in the US is $15,000 for 24 strand and $27,000 for burial per mile. However the area in question is full of historical areas and protected land that limits the fiber run to the most indirect path possible following a highway.
- southerntofu 5y ago
  Wow, that's a lot of money. I must admit i don't know about commercial fiber deployment so these numbers blow my mind. But from what i saw for the costs in big french cities (where there are established underground networks to pass cables) and french countryside (where you just use a tractor to dig "for free" on the border of a peasant's field) that sounds very expensive. To my knowledge, all french highways and major railways are also already populated with fiber so you can just rent some point-to-point transit there from established operators without having to lay your own. Good luck with this project keep us updated

fraserphysics 5y ago

I think there is something called REDInet that runs up 84 to Taos. And I've heard that Los Alamos County has some kind of in with that new path. Also, I think Comcast and others piggy back on the existing link that DOE uses. Finally, I want the County to hire someone to stay on top of such issues.

dreamcompiler 5y ago

Not sure the chance is zero. Since Los Alamos is a company town, you might be able to convince NNSA that it's in their best interest to create a community network for LANL enployees. Jill Hruby (who runs NNSA) is a reasonable person and she's from New Mexico. Can't hurt to ask.

fraserphysics 5y ago
Asking for help from NNSA is exactly the kind of thing I hope the broadband manager will do. We need to find and hire the broadband manager first.