7 ms·

Well, Linux definitely sucks. By a chance - is there anything better? Pretty please?.. Actually in case Fuchsia manages to replace - well, I would be happy. B

Well, Linux definitely sucks. By a chance - is there anything better? Pretty please?.. Actually in case Fuchsia manages to replace - well, I would be happy. But would it really happen?..

dnautics 5y ago
I want to know the answer to this. I have a really good track record of picking things that are about to get hot (julia, elixir, zig). As much as I love linux, I also hate it. I'm ready for the next OS.
- pshirshov 5y ago
  Noone is working on the next general purpose OS for the end user. Maybe apart of Google. For some reason people wish to stick with dated unsafe crap from prehistoric era.
  - hatmatrix 5y ago
    GNU Hurd should be ready any day now...
    - gjsman-1000 5y ago
      They got audio support in a basic form a few years ago. That's how far behind they are.
    - pshirshov 5y ago
      Ready for what?
      - AnimalMuppet 5y ago
        For being put out to pasture? Right, I'll show myself out...
  - zekrioca 5y ago
    You may do some more research [1]. [1] http://www.barrelfish.org/ http://www.barrelfish.org/
    - pshirshov 5y ago
      Looks like another pile of memory-unsafe C crap: http://git.barrelfish.org/?p=barrelfish;a=blobdiff;f=usr/drivers/enet/enet_module.c;h=e8f11dd91848091e0a4d9a8512f870f741f966b6;hp=a9e3c2d38b939ec0283c7be554333b6ade3ccb67;hb=0b09b6c6ec1971d38d0b474df37a6dcb9e44936c;hpb=29875f3479b15f92412772aa546a1a5ad0a2e0de http://git.barrelfish.org/?p=barrelfish;a=blobdiff;f=usr/dri... This will never become a modern OS. Wasted effort, wasted time, wasted money.
- yissp 5y ago
  [something].js https://xkcd.com/1508/ https://xkcd.com/1508/
  - dnautics 5y ago
    M.E.T.A.L (https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death-of-javascript https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death...) - hopefully "pandemic" won't take the place of the 5 years war between 2020 and 2025
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      That depends pretty much on the anti-vaccine folks.
bumblebritches5 5y ago
Fuscia
koolba 5y ago
Linux is like Democracy, it’s the worst except for all the alternatives.
Ekaros 5y ago
Windows
- pshirshov 5y ago
  Sorry, but what is "Windows"?
  - Ekaros 5y ago
    Nice little OS, has been around for a bit. Good backwards compatibility to boot.
    - pshirshov 5y ago
      I had a look at it, looks like another inconsistent pile of unsafe C crap stirred with tons of legacy frameworks and complete incoherence. Doesn't look like an OS at all.
      - pjmlp 5y ago
        Windows is a mix of legacy C code, which started to be migrated into C++ around the Vista time (hence /kernel in VC++) and .NET/COM (WinRT is basically COM with some extras). Modern kernel code makes use of WIL. https://github.com/microsoft/wil https://github.com/microsoft/wil
        jcelerier 5y ago
        > around the Vista time I remember stumbling on the win 3.11 sources on github at some point, C++ was already used back then
        pjmlp 5y ago
        For what would be "userspace" yes, but they were crazy enough to still do COM in C, given that by Windows 95 C++ was still unwelcomed on the kernel. https://devblogs.microsoft.com/oldnewthing/20210824-00/?p=105602 https://devblogs.microsoft.com/oldnewthing/20210824-00/?p=10...
dnautics 5y ago
> Actually in case Fuchsia manages to replace - well, I would be happy. But would it really happen?.. Would you be happy? Google has a poor track record of maintenance, not to mention monstrosities like angular, golang, kubernetes... I shudder to think about what a Google OS would look like.
- pshirshov 5y ago
  Well, fuchsia seems to be better designed and from what I've heard they had intention to rewrite their kernel in Rust. Eventually. Fuchsia seems to be FOSS. So, in case a new userland appears on top of this legacy-free system I, probably, would be happier than I am right now on damn Linux where nothing works as it should and everything segfaults.
  - dnautics 5y ago
    I think rust is a singularly poor choice to write a kernel, due to the datastructures required, poor support and interop between libraries and nostd, in the long run macros obscuring code and making understanding timing attacks difficult, e.g. but that's just my opinion... If you have the resources of google, you might as well write it in another language and apply a proof solver for security assurances (or just use SeL4).
  - tored 5y ago
    Problem is that the software license has become irrelevant for the largest tech companies. In the old days there was a fear among them, and probably rightly so, that their software would be "stolen" if they went open source. But today every large corporation is running projects as open source without any fear. What happened? For one these projects are so complex it is not feasible for Joe the programmer to read thru all of it, it takes a company of the size of Google or Microsoft to manage it. The other thing is that the business model changed. Now they give stuff away for "free" to lock you in and spy on your every move and then monetize it. Third is the close integration of hardware and software, so even if someone forked Fuchsia it would be utterly pointless because of hardware. What Google has shown is that it is possible to operate one of that largest spying agencies in the world all on open source.
amatecha 5y ago
You may want to check out the *BSD OSes like FreeBSD, OpenBSD and NetBSD. Just try them. Watch some videos to see what they're about. They might very well appeal to you. I personally think they are great and am embracing them (particularly OpenBSD) over Linux for most new computers I set up.

Well, Linux definitely sucks. By a chance - is there anything better? Pretty please?.. Actually in case Fuchsia manages to replace - well, I would be happy. But would it really happen?..

dnautics 5y ago

I want to know the answer to this. I have a really good track record of picking things that are about to get hot (julia, elixir, zig). As much as I love linux, I also hate it. I'm ready for the next OS.

pshirshov 5y ago
Noone is working on the next general purpose OS for the end user. Maybe apart of Google. For some reason people wish to stick with dated unsafe crap from prehistoric era.
- hatmatrix 5y ago
  GNU Hurd should be ready any day now...
  - gjsman-1000 5y ago
    They got audio support in a basic form a few years ago. That's how far behind they are.
  - pshirshov 5y ago
    Ready for what?
    - AnimalMuppet 5y ago
      For being put out to pasture? Right, I'll show myself out...
- zekrioca 5y ago
  You may do some more research [1]. [1] http://www.barrelfish.org/ http://www.barrelfish.org/
  - pshirshov 5y ago
    Looks like another pile of memory-unsafe C crap: http://git.barrelfish.org/?p=barrelfish;a=blobdiff;f=usr/drivers/enet/enet_module.c;h=e8f11dd91848091e0a4d9a8512f870f741f966b6;hp=a9e3c2d38b939ec0283c7be554333b6ade3ccb67;hb=0b09b6c6ec1971d38d0b474df37a6dcb9e44936c;hpb=29875f3479b15f92412772aa546a1a5ad0a2e0de http://git.barrelfish.org/?p=barrelfish;a=blobdiff;f=usr/dri... This will never become a modern OS. Wasted effort, wasted time, wasted money.
yissp 5y ago
[something].js https://xkcd.com/1508/ https://xkcd.com/1508/
- dnautics 5y ago
  M.E.T.A.L (https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death-of-javascript https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death...) - hopefully "pandemic" won't take the place of the 5 years war between 2020 and 2025
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    That depends pretty much on the anti-vaccine folks.

bumblebritches5 5y ago

Fuscia

koolba 5y ago

Linux is like Democracy, it’s the worst except for all the alternatives.

Ekaros 5y ago

Windows

pshirshov 5y ago
Sorry, but what is "Windows"?
- Ekaros 5y ago
  Nice little OS, has been around for a bit. Good backwards compatibility to boot.
  - pshirshov 5y ago
    I had a look at it, looks like another inconsistent pile of unsafe C crap stirred with tons of legacy frameworks and complete incoherence. Doesn't look like an OS at all.
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      Windows is a mix of legacy C code, which started to be migrated into C++ around the Vista time (hence /kernel in VC++) and .NET/COM (WinRT is basically COM with some extras). Modern kernel code makes use of WIL. https://github.com/microsoft/wil https://github.com/microsoft/wil
      - jcelerier 5y ago
        > around the Vista time I remember stumbling on the win 3.11 sources on github at some point, C++ was already used back then
        pjmlp 5y ago
        For what would be "userspace" yes, but they were crazy enough to still do COM in C, given that by Windows 95 C++ was still unwelcomed on the kernel. https://devblogs.microsoft.com/oldnewthing/20210824-00/?p=105602 https://devblogs.microsoft.com/oldnewthing/20210824-00/?p=10...

dnautics 5y ago

> Actually in case Fuchsia manages to replace - well, I would be happy. But would it really happen?.. Would you be happy? Google has a poor track record of maintenance, not to mention monstrosities like angular, golang, kubernetes... I shudder to think about what a Google OS would look like.

pshirshov 5y ago
Well, fuchsia seems to be better designed and from what I've heard they had intention to rewrite their kernel in Rust. Eventually. Fuchsia seems to be FOSS. So, in case a new userland appears on top of this legacy-free system I, probably, would be happier than I am right now on damn Linux where nothing works as it should and everything segfaults.
- dnautics 5y ago
  I think rust is a singularly poor choice to write a kernel, due to the datastructures required, poor support and interop between libraries and nostd, in the long run macros obscuring code and making understanding timing attacks difficult, e.g. but that's just my opinion... If you have the resources of google, you might as well write it in another language and apply a proof solver for security assurances (or just use SeL4).
- tored 5y ago
  Problem is that the software license has become irrelevant for the largest tech companies. In the old days there was a fear among them, and probably rightly so, that their software would be "stolen" if they went open source. But today every large corporation is running projects as open source without any fear. What happened? For one these projects are so complex it is not feasible for Joe the programmer to read thru all of it, it takes a company of the size of Google or Microsoft to manage it. The other thing is that the business model changed. Now they give stuff away for "free" to lock you in and spy on your every move and then monetize it. Third is the close integration of hardware and software, so even if someone forked Fuchsia it would be utterly pointless because of hardware. What Google has shown is that it is possible to operate one of that largest spying agencies in the world all on open source.

amatecha 5y ago

You may want to check out the *BSD OSes like FreeBSD, OpenBSD and NetBSD. Just try them. Watch some videos to see what they're about. They might very well appeal to you. I personally think they are great and am embracing them (particularly OpenBSD) over Linux for most new computers I set up.