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Australia, the US and UK to announce landmark new defence pact
- irrational 5y ago> the US would help Australia develop a nuclear submarine capability I wonder what help means? Is the US building the subs and turning them over to Australia, are they giving them plans and specs so they can build them themselves, or something in between?
- seanalltogether 5y agoProbably - "We'll allow you to buy 20 billion worth of submarines from our contractors if you guarantee our purchase of 20 billion worth of raw mining materials"
- jeeeb 5y agoIf historical Australian submarine deals are anything to go by construction work will be split between Australia and the US. I think it’s safe to assume Australia will want to develop a full maintenance capability in Australia, which realistically means developing a manufacturing capability.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- hollerith 5y agoThe US has been providing similar help to the UK since the 1960s. There, the US provided the missles (first Polaris, then Trident) and their launch tubes, while the UK built their own warheads and subs though I seem to recall the US's providing information (obtained from nuclear tests IIRC) important for warhead design and maybe nuclear material (i.e., plutonium).
- Throwawayaerlei 5y agoWe currently replenish the tritium used to boost the primaries of their nukes.
- robbiep 5y agoAnother SMH article mentions Scomo said they intend to build them in Adelaide
- gghhzzgghhzz 5y agoAnother scam to funnel public money to US arms manufacturers
- dgs_sgd 5y agoProbably, but do you think it’s at least in part a legitimate response to the Chinese threat?
- Lammy 5y agoI bet China says all the same things about us to also justify building things that spy and kill.
- gumby 5y agoHonestly what actual Chinese threat?
- Sophistifunk 5y agoIs that a joke? If China invades Taiwan and the nuclear umbrella is proven to be a fraud, the entire world order will come to a screeching halt as Japan and South Korea kick off an asia-wide arms race, because they have to. And that's assuming Kim does nothing at all.
- locusm 5y agoUnlikely this would have happened had it not been for the perceived Chinese threat.
- AnotherGoodName 5y agoA gauge of the reactions in /r/australia show strong support from the left and right wings in Australia. It's rare to see such agreement. Also 12 of them is a sizable fleet. Larger than the UK or French nuclear sub fleets. So yes. It's China. Particularly China under Xi Jinping.
- dirtyid 5y agoThese are replacing the 12 subs ordered from France, itself replacing 6 current Collins class due for replacement in the early 2030s. The french contract was missing deadlines, and there is even less chance these boats will be on schedule considering they're nukes. So total 6 extra hulls, typically 1/3 will be deployed while others train or maintain. Does extra presence of 2 subs dramatically affect PRC strategic planning in the 2040s/50s. Maybe, but not that much.
- pretendgeneer 5y agoCan't believe we'll get Nuclear Subs but not Nuclear power to combat the actual looming threat of climate change.
- tbihl 5y agoNo one gets nuclear power, including the people with the subs. We're all phasing it out, out of a shared understanding that the political fight is worse than the climate and other impacts of just letting it die.
- nickhalfasleep 5y agoOr that nobody can make it affordable compared to other clean energy solutions.
- bassman9000 5y agoPower requirements on a sub vs a civilian power plant are on a different scale. A vessel reactor is small enough it easily contained and shielded, by comparison. You get free cooling. And it doesn't have to be cost effective. I'd like more civilian reactors too. But scaling is an issue.
- aaron695 5y agoThis is about the nuclear submarines. It's 100's of billions of dollars. Currently all countries with nuclear-powered submarines have nuclear weapons. Australia has been a hillbilly nation for a long while, they were literally looking at buying nuclear-powered submarines and converting them to diesel. The have the expertise to deal with nuclear, the resources and a strategic position. It could be a chance for them to grow up. Traditionally they have used their large land size for digging. Farming and minerals. They have educated themselves at a high level but they do not use that except to sell education to others then send the locals to the mines. It's hard to know if it's possible for Australia to pivot. Pride in being uneducated, like the fear of nuclear and the cult of environmentalism is as toxic there as anywhere else and they have left it late. But we will see. Biden's announcement - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGYzQERSjmQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGYzQERSjmQ
- Ronson 5y agoForgive my ignorance and especially how broad a surface. I am actually clueless in the grand scheme. All our countries in some way buy everything from China, at least in the UK? Everything I have is in some way stamped with "Made in China" since I was quite young looking at my xmas toys. It seems to still be that way. The UK economy wants me to take out a credit card, get a haircut, buy a beer, then buy a sandwich and maybe stay in a hotel. If I want a TV, Fridge, Phone, Table, Standing Desk, Motor, Bicycle... It's made in China. Over the years, I have seen information about the rise of China, when I go to my capital city, the vast majority of people I see are Chinese tourists, far more than I have ever seen American's despite being closer. What I am just wondering is, the UK doesn't have a pot to piss in. In this country it will take decades to pay for a tiny little rail link whilst in China, they are laying high speed rail at a pace that literally blows my mind. I can't put my finger on it but what is the point in this for spending money? America is a bag holder, the UK is involved to make it seem important, and what is the end goal for Australia? What is the actual end goal for any of us? I need a new fridge, all my options are Chinese. But pretend that a submarine and some missles protect us? Until when? 2040 as your grandkid is paying covid while China booms? What am I missing here?
- DaveExeter 5y agoAUKUS? Is there no better branding then...AUKUS?
- Lammy 5y agoI wonder how the nuclear submarine stuff will affect ANZUS: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANZUS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANZUS "New Zealand was suspended from ANZUS in 1986 as it initiated a nuclear-free zone in its territorial waters; in late 2012 New Zealand lifted a ban on visits by United States warships leading to a thawing in tensions. New Zealand maintains a nuclear-free zone as part of its foreign policy and is partially suspended from ANZUS, as the United States maintains an ambiguous policy whether or not the warships carry nuclear weapons and operates numerous nuclear-powered aircraft carriers and submarines; however New Zealand resumed key areas of the ANZUS treaty in 2007."
- gumby 5y agoGuess no nuke subs making port of call across the Tasman sea.
- DaveExeter 5y agoNew Zealand is anti-nuke? You'd think they would be pro-nuke! Sometimes a small country needs a big equalizer. For example...North Korea.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- excalibur 5y agoMaybe we can get Malaysia involved, then we can call it MABUS.
- stubish 5y agoWe should rebrand it USUKA
- gumby 5y agoThank you SMH for you choice of photos.