5 ms·

I'm reading "Four Thousand Weeks" by Oliver Burkeman. His central thesis is that you will do almost none of the things that you might have done—you only get 400

by Veen 5y ago

I'm reading "Four Thousand Weeks" by Oliver Burkeman. His central thesis is that you will do almost none of the things that you might have done—you only get 4000 weeks give or take. You'll have almost none of the experiences you might have had. A human life is incredibly constrained and you just have to accept that—there's no getting around it. Once you do accept it, regret doesn't make a lot of sense: you did this instead of that, but so what? There's an infinity of other things you didn't do and never could have done. Instead, focus on the life you have and living it as best as you possibly can. It doesn't last, and the real waste would be to spend your time regretting the past or using every moment to prepare for a future which might not come and won't be what you expected if it does (real life never matches the expectations we create in our fantasy version of the future).

asplake 5y ago
This. Make decisions, own them, accept the consequences, live and learn.
toxik 5y ago
On the other hand, you have tremendous agency in your life. Denying it is just as unhealthy as obsessing about it. As always, the most sensible approach is somewhere in between.
playpause 5y ago
> There's an infinity of other things you didn't do and never could have done. Instead, focus on the life you have and living it as best as you possibly can. This seems tricky to reconcile. How do you focus on living the best life you possibly can while also remaining indifferent to all the things you could have done?
- machinerychorus 5y ago
  I think you have to find a healthy balance, where you give it your best effort but also accept that it'll never be perfect.
- Barrin92 5y ago
  Kierkegaard (who had a lot to say on this topic of the self), would have observed that recognizing that it is tricky to reconcile is one very important step. Man is both finite and infinite (or as Ernest Becker put it, half animal, half symbolic) and the entire task of recognizing one's self is dealing with this paradoxical nature. The suggestion of the top comment to 'accept it' Kierkegaard argues is no solution, it is regression into the finite, vanishing into the crowd. One might be contempt and safe, but still in despair, even without knowing it, which is the worst kind. Getting lost in the infinite, (choice despite being bound by one's finite nature) leads to the paralysis of choice and despair over options not realized. The actual answer is, according to Kierkegaard, not to remain indifferent, but understand that exactly this struggle is what brings awareness to the self and in his religious reading, God. (which I think does not necessarily have to be taken literally if someone prefers a secular interpretation, he sometimes also spoke of 'creation' or simply, love). "[...]Ah! So much is spoken about human need and misery and how to overcome it. So much is spoken about wasting our lives. But the only wasted life is the life of one who has so lived it, deceived by life’s pleasures or its sorrows, that that person never became decisively, eternally, conscious of him or herself as spirit, as a self. Or, if I may put it another way, such a person has never become aware — and gained in the deepest sense the impression — that there is a God and that that person, him or herself, is answerable to and exists before this God, and that this God can only be met by way of despair. Alas! so many live their lives in denial, decapitated from eternity. So many are not aware of their true destiny, defrauding themselves of this most blessed of all realities."
  - moksly 5y ago
    > (which I think does not necessarily have to be taken literally if someone prefers a secular interpretation This would land you on one of the earlier stages on Kierkegaards path to “enlightenment”. It’s extremely hard to follow kierkegaard down the path you want without including faith. It’s important to note that kierkegaard saw the Christian Church of Denmark as the biggest opponent of Christianity, however, and as such it’s entirely possible to take the lessons and direct your faith wherever you may want. Religion to kierkegaard was two things. It was organised religion and following rituals without ever questioning it. And it was self enlightenment in coming to realise that there is more to the world than you will ever understand and that God is real. Then again, Kierkegaard also favoured monarchy above democracy, and you can certainly pick and chose, but I really don’t see how you can interpret Kierkegaards stages of life without faith considering the final answer is solely about faith. > The suggestion of the top comment to 'accept it' Kierkegaard argues is no solution, it is regression into the finite, vanishing into the crowd. That’s not exactly right is it? Kierkegaard very specifically commented on regret as useless and one of the most famous quotes of his is “hang yourself and you will regret it, don’t hang yourself and you’ll regret that as well. Hang or don’t hang yourself, you will regret your decision either way.” You’re right as far as not letting regret limit you, but if not shooting for the stars is where your meaning is, then Kierkegaard is not against that as is shown in two other famous quotes. On on the fruitlessness of being busy achieving things that have no deeper meaning to you, and one on the virtue of being idle and unproductive to society but engaged within your own mind.
- coldtea 5y ago
  >How do you focus on living the best life you possibly can while also remaining indifferent to all the things you could have done? One could start by appreciating what they were did given the chance to do. After all, they had signed no contract with the universe that they should do all things - or even that they should do anything specific.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
machinerychorus 5y ago
I made a live wallpaper for android based on this idea. It shows what percentage of your life has already gone by. Some people find this depressing, but I think it's a good reminder to think about how I spend my time. app: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.machinerychorus.lifeprogresswallpaper https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.machineryc... code: https://github.com/ethanmdavidson/DeathProgress https://github.com/ethanmdavidson/DeathProgress
- vinay427 5y ago
  Thanks, I will check out the live wallpaper. There's also the Wait But Why post about this [1] with a physical calendar that they sell. My favorite option so far, however, is the customizable printable calendar written by someone else that can be generated online [2] or run locally (Python) [3], both adapting to your date of birth for easier use, and the Python code can obviously be customized for any of your other needs by editing the script. [1] https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/life-weeks.html https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/life-weeks.html [2] https://www.ekn.io/calendar/ https://www.ekn.io/calendar/ [3] https://github.com/eriknyquist/generate_life_calendar https://github.com/eriknyquist/generate_life_calendar
willis936 5y ago
But if you know you will regret not doing more adventurous things then you minimize regret to correct the course.
yesOfCourse9 5y ago
The average middle class house has more luxury than kings of old available. Billions of humans died before we got where we are. I don’t really see a reason to a) push each other as hard as we do; that hard for incremental linear economic gains inequitably distributed? To gain even more minor improvement? Haha b) see the need to do perform harder as much more than a chemical delusion Billionaires got there by gaming biology, not building the entirety of society. I’d be a billionaire if I had a network of sycophants telling everyone I’m a billionaire too. Our culture has jumped the shark. I look forward to the bubble bursting.
- rjbwork 5y ago
  Trillions is definitely hyperbolic. Estimates I've read is ~100 billion or so humans to ever exist.
- dsr_ 5y ago
  Before 1880 or so, if you wanted to listen to music, you played an instrument yourself, went to a pre-arranged concert on their schedule, or were incredibly wealthy and paid musicians to give you concerts. In the 1920s you bought a radio or phonograph. In the 1980s you bought tapes and then CDs and could listen on the go. Now you can pay a subscription service and a bandwidth bill and get much of human music anytime, and nearly anywhere. Food was stuff you or your neighbors grew; then it was stuff from your area; after refrigeration it could come from anywhere. Books and television are cheaper than they've ever been before; movies are more available.
  - zwieback 5y ago
    Yet I grow food in my garden (inefficiently) and play instruments for fun (not very well), because modern life is so convenient I can do those things. I'm thanking my lucky stars and never worry about what regrets I might have in the future but also have to answer my daughters' questions whether they will have those luxuries. At age 85 I might have regrets that I should have done more to preserve things for the next generation. Then again, we're terrible at predicting the future...
philwelch 5y ago
I agree it's valuable not to be too picky about your life experiences, but at the same time, it's a safe bet that you're going to regret spending too many of those 4,000 weeks repeating the same low-value experiences over and over again. It's dumb to say, "I regret never jumping out of an airplane because I spent too many weekends climbing mountains or hunting moose or taking my wife on romantic getaways". It's perfectly reasonable to say, "I regret never jumping out of an airplane OR climbing a mountain OR hunting a moose because I literally spent every weekend getting drunk and playing video games in my underwear".

by Veen 5y ago

asplake 5y ago

This. Make decisions, own them, accept the consequences, live and learn.

toxik 5y ago

On the other hand, you have tremendous agency in your life. Denying it is just as unhealthy as obsessing about it. As always, the most sensible approach is somewhere in between.

playpause 5y ago

> There's an infinity of other things you didn't do and never could have done. Instead, focus on the life you have and living it as best as you possibly can. This seems tricky to reconcile. How do you focus on living the best life you possibly can while also remaining indifferent to all the things you could have done?

machinerychorus 5y ago
I think you have to find a healthy balance, where you give it your best effort but also accept that it'll never be perfect.
Barrin92 5y ago
Kierkegaard (who had a lot to say on this topic of the self), would have observed that recognizing that it is tricky to reconcile is one very important step. Man is both finite and infinite (or as Ernest Becker put it, half animal, half symbolic) and the entire task of recognizing one's self is dealing with this paradoxical nature. The suggestion of the top comment to 'accept it' Kierkegaard argues is no solution, it is regression into the finite, vanishing into the crowd. One might be contempt and safe, but still in despair, even without knowing it, which is the worst kind. Getting lost in the infinite, (choice despite being bound by one's finite nature) leads to the paralysis of choice and despair over options not realized. The actual answer is, according to Kierkegaard, not to remain indifferent, but understand that exactly this struggle is what brings awareness to the self and in his religious reading, God. (which I think does not necessarily have to be taken literally if someone prefers a secular interpretation, he sometimes also spoke of 'creation' or simply, love). "[...]Ah! So much is spoken about human need and misery and how to overcome it. So much is spoken about wasting our lives. But the only wasted life is the life of one who has so lived it, deceived by life’s pleasures or its sorrows, that that person never became decisively, eternally, conscious of him or herself as spirit, as a self. Or, if I may put it another way, such a person has never become aware — and gained in the deepest sense the impression — that there is a God and that that person, him or herself, is answerable to and exists before this God, and that this God can only be met by way of despair. Alas! so many live their lives in denial, decapitated from eternity. So many are not aware of their true destiny, defrauding themselves of this most blessed of all realities."
- moksly 5y ago
  > (which I think does not necessarily have to be taken literally if someone prefers a secular interpretation This would land you on one of the earlier stages on Kierkegaards path to “enlightenment”. It’s extremely hard to follow kierkegaard down the path you want without including faith. It’s important to note that kierkegaard saw the Christian Church of Denmark as the biggest opponent of Christianity, however, and as such it’s entirely possible to take the lessons and direct your faith wherever you may want. Religion to kierkegaard was two things. It was organised religion and following rituals without ever questioning it. And it was self enlightenment in coming to realise that there is more to the world than you will ever understand and that God is real. Then again, Kierkegaard also favoured monarchy above democracy, and you can certainly pick and chose, but I really don’t see how you can interpret Kierkegaards stages of life without faith considering the final answer is solely about faith. > The suggestion of the top comment to 'accept it' Kierkegaard argues is no solution, it is regression into the finite, vanishing into the crowd. That’s not exactly right is it? Kierkegaard very specifically commented on regret as useless and one of the most famous quotes of his is “hang yourself and you will regret it, don’t hang yourself and you’ll regret that as well. Hang or don’t hang yourself, you will regret your decision either way.” You’re right as far as not letting regret limit you, but if not shooting for the stars is where your meaning is, then Kierkegaard is not against that as is shown in two other famous quotes. On on the fruitlessness of being busy achieving things that have no deeper meaning to you, and one on the virtue of being idle and unproductive to society but engaged within your own mind.
coldtea 5y ago
>How do you focus on living the best life you possibly can while also remaining indifferent to all the things you could have done? One could start by appreciating what they were did given the chance to do. After all, they had signed no contract with the universe that they should do all things - or even that they should do anything specific.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

machinerychorus 5y ago

I made a live wallpaper for android based on this idea. It shows what percentage of your life has already gone by. Some people find this depressing, but I think it's a good reminder to think about how I spend my time. app: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.machinerychorus.lifeprogresswallpaper https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.machineryc... code: https://github.com/ethanmdavidson/DeathProgress https://github.com/ethanmdavidson/DeathProgress

vinay427 5y ago
Thanks, I will check out the live wallpaper. There's also the Wait But Why post about this [1] with a physical calendar that they sell. My favorite option so far, however, is the customizable printable calendar written by someone else that can be generated online [2] or run locally (Python) [3], both adapting to your date of birth for easier use, and the Python code can obviously be customized for any of your other needs by editing the script. [1] https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/life-weeks.html https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/life-weeks.html [2] https://www.ekn.io/calendar/ https://www.ekn.io/calendar/ [3] https://github.com/eriknyquist/generate_life_calendar https://github.com/eriknyquist/generate_life_calendar

willis936 5y ago

But if you know you will regret not doing more adventurous things then you minimize regret to correct the course.

yesOfCourse9 5y ago

The average middle class house has more luxury than kings of old available. Billions of humans died before we got where we are. I don’t really see a reason to a) push each other as hard as we do; that hard for incremental linear economic gains inequitably distributed? To gain even more minor improvement? Haha b) see the need to do perform harder as much more than a chemical delusion Billionaires got there by gaming biology, not building the entirety of society. I’d be a billionaire if I had a network of sycophants telling everyone I’m a billionaire too. Our culture has jumped the shark. I look forward to the bubble bursting.

rjbwork 5y ago
Trillions is definitely hyperbolic. Estimates I've read is ~100 billion or so humans to ever exist.
dsr_ 5y ago
Before 1880 or so, if you wanted to listen to music, you played an instrument yourself, went to a pre-arranged concert on their schedule, or were incredibly wealthy and paid musicians to give you concerts. In the 1920s you bought a radio or phonograph. In the 1980s you bought tapes and then CDs and could listen on the go. Now you can pay a subscription service and a bandwidth bill and get much of human music anytime, and nearly anywhere. Food was stuff you or your neighbors grew; then it was stuff from your area; after refrigeration it could come from anywhere. Books and television are cheaper than they've ever been before; movies are more available.
- zwieback 5y ago
  Yet I grow food in my garden (inefficiently) and play instruments for fun (not very well), because modern life is so convenient I can do those things. I'm thanking my lucky stars and never worry about what regrets I might have in the future but also have to answer my daughters' questions whether they will have those luxuries. At age 85 I might have regrets that I should have done more to preserve things for the next generation. Then again, we're terrible at predicting the future...

philwelch 5y ago

I agree it's valuable not to be too picky about your life experiences, but at the same time, it's a safe bet that you're going to regret spending too many of those 4,000 weeks repeating the same low-value experiences over and over again. It's dumb to say, "I regret never jumping out of an airplane because I spent too many weekends climbing mountains or hunting moose or taking my wife on romantic getaways". It's perfectly reasonable to say, "I regret never jumping out of an airplane OR climbing a mountain OR hunting a moose because I literally spent every weekend getting drunk and playing video games in my underwear".