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If you're referring to https://uw.leftium.com/ https://uw.leftium.com/, tap the temperature in landscape mode ;) The app defaults to F because it gives the mor

If you're referring to https://uw.leftium.com/ https://uw.leftium.com/, tap the temperature in landscape mode ;) The app defaults to F because it gives the more "human" temperature range.

cstrat 5y ago
This doesn't seem to work on desktop? I've never heard of F as the more 'human' temperature range. Don't you either use C or F. Since I've never used F it doesn't seem more human to me.
- pjerem 5y ago
  Temperatures in °F always feel to me like climate change is donne for good and the atmosphere is now able to boil water in summer.
- Leftium 5y ago
  On desktop you may need to adjust the browser window size until it's portrait aspect ratio. On windows I snap it to half the screen. In landscape the app shows the extended forecast. Sorry I'm on mobile and can't link directly to the relevant part of the video: https://youtu.be/BMGrsOawKac https://youtu.be/BMGrsOawKac Basically F gives more precise info/digit for the temperature ranges humans experience. 99F is near the top of the range, while 99C is unheard of for weather on Earth. So F gives approximately twice the precision. To get the same precision in C you have to add decimals
  - tlamponi 5y ago
    > Basically F gives more precise info/digit for the temperature ranges humans experience. 99F is near the top of the range, while 99C is unheard of for weather on Earth. So F gives approximately twice the precision. To get the same precision in C you have to add decimals Same amount of bits used either way, i.e., you can also use dezi-Celsius, e.g. 22.5 °C = 225° dC, while not commonly used when displaying it, it gives just the same info and is often used in µC; so that's really not an argument for Fahrenheit. The top-range being 100 °F is just nonsense, there are lots of places with 110° F (~43° C) and also some with 120°F (~50° C) and some places that top out at 70° F (~21° C) in summer. Also, that would imply that bottom is 0° F (~ -17° C) and mid-range is 50° F (~ 10° C), both aren't true for either observed temperatures in most parts of the world nor would 50° F be a good level for human comfort, which is subjective anyhow. The single thing that could make one think that a temperature scale is a better fit for human consumption is being used to that scale. If one grows up with °F then naturally °F is the scale than one can better relate to, similar with Celsius. The actual benefits of Celsius are relation to freezing and boiling point (combined with barometric pressure) of water, something that is daily used by a lot of people (cook pasta, make ice cubes, know not to lick metal poles at <0°C, ...) and more importantly, can actually be objectively related too. In addition to that it scales 1:1 with Kelvin, a scale that actually has a defined lower end that matters a lot in our universe.
    - Leftium 5y ago
      Yes, same amount of bits, but different number of digits and thus screen real estate. I was speaking from personal experience. One of the reasons I made it easy to toggle between F and C in my app was so I could adjust from F to C (in Korea). I think it worked and I am comfortable using both C and F now (although I admit I am more accustomed to F). However, one thing I noticed when I switch to C in my app is I get less information. I have seen systems that double the C reading to get a similar precision as F, but then it is no longer really C. My point was not that temperatures don't go over 100F, but that F uses the entire range of 2-digit readings. C only uses half of the positive 2-digit range. Also because freezing in F is above 0, you can show a useful range of temperatures below freezing before having to add a negative sign. So I still argue F is more information-dense than C given a 2-digit temperature reading for weather.
- Leftium 5y ago
  I found the exact timestamp in the video, but MKBDH actually didn't explain it very well. So I found some other articles that articulate why F is better for weather: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505
niatrecsa 5y ago
Is it possible to pass a query string parameter, for choosing either C or F? That would be fantastic for bookmarking, to save that extra click. :) ... and I'll add, awesome work. I love simple sites like this that are built well and are actually useful. Well done.
- Leftium 5y ago
  Great idea. It should be simple to add. Just need to connect the variable that controls C/F display with the logic that handles other query string parameters. https://github.com/Leftium/ultra-weather https://github.com/Leftium/ultra-weather
severak_cz 5y ago
> The app defaults to F because it gives the more "human" temperature range. It because you are american. For europeans using celsius this is more like hieroglyphs (but I understand it works same other way around).
- Leftium 5y ago
  I've learned to use both C/F (although I admit I am more accustomed to F). More detailed arguments for F for weather here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505 Merits of Metric vs. Imperial generalized: - Metric: science-based, regular (powers of 10) - Imperial: human-scaled, divisible (many divisors, including 3) An inch is about the breadth of a human thumb, and a foot is 12 inches. (Also about the length of a human foot.) For example, a surfer says "if you measure wave height in metres or cm it is not as accurate compared to the human body (a 6ft wave is under 2 m and we would not call a wave 182.88 cm high)" edit: length -> breadth
  - damienpirsy 5y ago
    possibily one of the worst arguments in favor of something I've ever heard. "human-scaled" just because you grew up in a culture that uses them. In my mind, a foot doesn't mean anything since my foot, my wife's and my daughter's are quite different in lenght, while 30cm is 30cm for everyone - and once you start using meters as unity of measure you can easily envision it in your mind. So, please stop saying "it's clearer", it's NOT.
shoto_io 5y ago
Yes I was referring to leftum. Can't you just check the IP? Or introduce a toggle on desktop?
- Leftium 5y ago
  The app's main use case was for mobile, where you can easily toggle between portrait and landscape. And I am using it fine on desktop by toggling with the Windows snap feature. But yes, a toggle on desktop would be nice and more user-friendly...

If you're referring to https://uw.leftium.com/ https://uw.leftium.com/, tap the temperature in landscape mode ;) The app defaults to F because it gives the more "human" temperature range.

cstrat 5y ago

This doesn't seem to work on desktop? I've never heard of F as the more 'human' temperature range. Don't you either use C or F. Since I've never used F it doesn't seem more human to me.

pjerem 5y ago
Temperatures in °F always feel to me like climate change is donne for good and the atmosphere is now able to boil water in summer.
Leftium 5y ago
On desktop you may need to adjust the browser window size until it's portrait aspect ratio. On windows I snap it to half the screen. In landscape the app shows the extended forecast. Sorry I'm on mobile and can't link directly to the relevant part of the video: https://youtu.be/BMGrsOawKac https://youtu.be/BMGrsOawKac Basically F gives more precise info/digit for the temperature ranges humans experience. 99F is near the top of the range, while 99C is unheard of for weather on Earth. So F gives approximately twice the precision. To get the same precision in C you have to add decimals
- tlamponi 5y ago
  > Basically F gives more precise info/digit for the temperature ranges humans experience. 99F is near the top of the range, while 99C is unheard of for weather on Earth. So F gives approximately twice the precision. To get the same precision in C you have to add decimals Same amount of bits used either way, i.e., you can also use dezi-Celsius, e.g. 22.5 °C = 225° dC, while not commonly used when displaying it, it gives just the same info and is often used in µC; so that's really not an argument for Fahrenheit. The top-range being 100 °F is just nonsense, there are lots of places with 110° F (~43° C) and also some with 120°F (~50° C) and some places that top out at 70° F (~21° C) in summer. Also, that would imply that bottom is 0° F (~ -17° C) and mid-range is 50° F (~ 10° C), both aren't true for either observed temperatures in most parts of the world nor would 50° F be a good level for human comfort, which is subjective anyhow. The single thing that could make one think that a temperature scale is a better fit for human consumption is being used to that scale. If one grows up with °F then naturally °F is the scale than one can better relate to, similar with Celsius. The actual benefits of Celsius are relation to freezing and boiling point (combined with barometric pressure) of water, something that is daily used by a lot of people (cook pasta, make ice cubes, know not to lick metal poles at <0°C, ...) and more importantly, can actually be objectively related too. In addition to that it scales 1:1 with Kelvin, a scale that actually has a defined lower end that matters a lot in our universe.
  - Leftium 5y ago
    Yes, same amount of bits, but different number of digits and thus screen real estate. I was speaking from personal experience. One of the reasons I made it easy to toggle between F and C in my app was so I could adjust from F to C (in Korea). I think it worked and I am comfortable using both C and F now (although I admit I am more accustomed to F). However, one thing I noticed when I switch to C in my app is I get less information. I have seen systems that double the C reading to get a similar precision as F, but then it is no longer really C. My point was not that temperatures don't go over 100F, but that F uses the entire range of 2-digit readings. C only uses half of the positive 2-digit range. Also because freezing in F is above 0, you can show a useful range of temperatures below freezing before having to add a negative sign. So I still argue F is more information-dense than C given a 2-digit temperature reading for weather.
Leftium 5y ago
I found the exact timestamp in the video, but MKBDH actually didn't explain it very well. So I found some other articles that articulate why F is better for weather: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505

niatrecsa 5y ago

Is it possible to pass a query string parameter, for choosing either C or F? That would be fantastic for bookmarking, to save that extra click. :) ... and I'll add, awesome work. I love simple sites like this that are built well and are actually useful. Well done.

Leftium 5y ago
Great idea. It should be simple to add. Just need to connect the variable that controls C/F display with the logic that handles other query string parameters. https://github.com/Leftium/ultra-weather https://github.com/Leftium/ultra-weather

severak_cz 5y ago

> The app defaults to F because it gives the more "human" temperature range. It because you are american. For europeans using celsius this is more like hieroglyphs (but I understand it works same other way around).

Leftium 5y ago
I've learned to use both C/F (although I admit I am more accustomed to F). More detailed arguments for F for weather here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28524505 Merits of Metric vs. Imperial generalized: - Metric: science-based, regular (powers of 10) - Imperial: human-scaled, divisible (many divisors, including 3) An inch is about the breadth of a human thumb, and a foot is 12 inches. (Also about the length of a human foot.) For example, a surfer says "if you measure wave height in metres or cm it is not as accurate compared to the human body (a 6ft wave is under 2 m and we would not call a wave 182.88 cm high)" edit: length -> breadth
- damienpirsy 5y ago
  possibily one of the worst arguments in favor of something I've ever heard. "human-scaled" just because you grew up in a culture that uses them. In my mind, a foot doesn't mean anything since my foot, my wife's and my daughter's are quite different in lenght, while 30cm is 30cm for everyone - and once you start using meters as unity of measure you can easily envision it in your mind. So, please stop saying "it's clearer", it's NOT.

shoto_io 5y ago

Yes I was referring to leftum. Can't you just check the IP? Or introduce a toggle on desktop?

Leftium 5y ago
The app's main use case was for mobile, where you can easily toggle between portrait and landscape. And I am using it fine on desktop by toggling with the Windows snap feature. But yes, a toggle on desktop would be nice and more user-friendly...