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> Taxi drivers are not knowledge workers, or artists and clearly not entrepreneurs. Of course they're entrepreneurs. They have to own or finance a car. They ch

by bko 5y ago

> Taxi drivers are not knowledge workers, or artists and clearly not entrepreneurs. Of course they're entrepreneurs. They have to own or finance a car. They choose when and where to work and for what company to drive for. They can also work for black car in addition to ride share and can even manage private rides. They have some ability to accept or reject fares. > There's a reason why humanity introduced protections for vulnerable workers in almost every society. No one is restricting "knowledge workers" from being able to strike a contract. Why can't we afford the same dignity and respect to "cogs in the machine"? You ever thing these "protections" that "humanity" places on "cogs" can end up hurting them? Like how immigrant taxi drivers in NYC were encouraged to rack up 100k debt to buy medallions

st1ck 5y ago
I'd expect entrepreneur to have a freedom to set own rate and market own brand, for example.
- bko 5y ago
  You can choose when and where to work. Most businesses don't have pricing power. There's a market price. They can charge more or less sure but in theory there's a market clearing price, and anything above/below that price will yield suboptimal returns. You're romanticizing the discretion individual businesses have.
goodpoint 5y ago
> Of course they're entrepreneurs. They have to own or finance a car. That's such a broad definition of entrepreneur that includes 99% of freelancers and self-employed. > No one is restricting "knowledge workers" from being able to strike a contract. The job market does, unfortunately.
ClumsyPilot 5y ago
"Of course they're entrepreneurs. They have to own or finance a car." When we were taught business in school, it was about setting the price, hiring staff, choosing a target market. You know, thigs that make a business a business. I am willing to bet my house that there isn't a single business or economics testbook where maintaining a car is even a consideration.
- bko 5y ago
  > When we were taught business in school, it was about setting the price, hiring staff, choosing a target market. You know, thigs that make a business a business. You have a very narrow understanding of business and entrepreneurship. Not all businesses have employees. Every business book will tell you almost all businesses are price takers, not price setters. You can't wave a wand and say "I want to charge X". The target market could be Uber, Lyft, black car, limo or personal. Maintaining equipment and accounting for depreciation is very important
  - ClumsyPilot 5y ago
    "You can't wave a wand and say "I want to charge X" Of course you can! Whether anyone pays is another matter. "The target market could be Uber" 1 company is a customer, not a market. You are perverting the term to the point where it looses all meaning. It's like Agile - everything is agile now. "Maintaining equipment and accounting for depreciation is very important" So is a regular exercise routine, but neither of them defines a business. Are half the country are 'entrepreneurs' now because they have to drive kids to school? This is absurd! You don't like my criteria, fine, but the only criteria you put forward aren't even relevant to lawyers, accountant and hundreds of other kinds of Real businesses that do have employees, set the price, run their marketing, etc.
jacquesm 5y ago
There is a very simple litmus test to decide if someone is an entrepreneur or not: do they own the customer relationship? If they do they are an entrepreneur otherwise they aren't. This is the core of the dispute with the app stores and various companies as well: they don't want to end up at the mercy of a third party for their customer relationships.

by bko 5y ago

st1ck 5y ago

I'd expect entrepreneur to have a freedom to set own rate and market own brand, for example.

bko 5y ago
You can choose when and where to work. Most businesses don't have pricing power. There's a market price. They can charge more or less sure but in theory there's a market clearing price, and anything above/below that price will yield suboptimal returns. You're romanticizing the discretion individual businesses have.

goodpoint 5y ago

> Of course they're entrepreneurs. They have to own or finance a car. That's such a broad definition of entrepreneur that includes 99% of freelancers and self-employed. > No one is restricting "knowledge workers" from being able to strike a contract. The job market does, unfortunately.

ClumsyPilot 5y ago

"Of course they're entrepreneurs. They have to own or finance a car." When we were taught business in school, it was about setting the price, hiring staff, choosing a target market. You know, thigs that make a business a business. I am willing to bet my house that there isn't a single business or economics testbook where maintaining a car is even a consideration.

bko 5y ago
> When we were taught business in school, it was about setting the price, hiring staff, choosing a target market. You know, thigs that make a business a business. You have a very narrow understanding of business and entrepreneurship. Not all businesses have employees. Every business book will tell you almost all businesses are price takers, not price setters. You can't wave a wand and say "I want to charge X". The target market could be Uber, Lyft, black car, limo or personal. Maintaining equipment and accounting for depreciation is very important
- ClumsyPilot 5y ago
  "You can't wave a wand and say "I want to charge X" Of course you can! Whether anyone pays is another matter. "The target market could be Uber" 1 company is a customer, not a market. You are perverting the term to the point where it looses all meaning. It's like Agile - everything is agile now. "Maintaining equipment and accounting for depreciation is very important" So is a regular exercise routine, but neither of them defines a business. Are half the country are 'entrepreneurs' now because they have to drive kids to school? This is absurd! You don't like my criteria, fine, but the only criteria you put forward aren't even relevant to lawyers, accountant and hundreds of other kinds of Real businesses that do have employees, set the price, run their marketing, etc.

jacquesm 5y ago

There is a very simple litmus test to decide if someone is an entrepreneur or not: do they own the customer relationship? If they do they are an entrepreneur otherwise they aren't. This is the core of the dispute with the app stores and various companies as well: they don't want to end up at the mercy of a third party for their customer relationships.