3 ms·

> I mean the stakes were incredibly high, billions in revenue for the foreseeable future. That's exactly why the first sequel movie (EpVII: TFA) was so timid;

by mLuby 5y ago

> I mean the stakes were incredibly high, billions in revenue for the foreseeable future. That's exactly why the first sequel movie (EpVII: TFA) was so timid; I'm sure it was the most de-risked thing the writers and execs could think of—just a re-skin of the original. > cheapening the force and the ability to wield it… It's telling that the secondary things - Rogue One, Mandalorian - are fan favorites instead. Star Wars suffers from power and stakes creep: Death Star I is a planet-killer; DS2 kills planets and ships: Starkiller Base is a multi-planet killer; every ship in the Exegol fleet is a planet-killer. Force abilities are another example. The Force co-opts any story it touches into one about destiny. And sometimes that's not appropriate, as in tales about rebel troopers or backwater mercenaries. As much as I adored The Child and was excited about Luke's cameo, I'm really glad those two things exited the show, hopefully resetting the stakes at a lower level.

missblit 5y ago
There are tons of ways to write a story involving the force that doesn't boil down to destiny or power creep. Jedi are essentially swordsmen / samurai / ronin characters; and not every swordsman needs to be in a hero villain pair. And there's plenty of fun stuff in the EU (Luke's Jedi academy, the force blocking Ysalamari lizards, Sith Holocrons, etc.) that could have been used to write a solid force-centric plot. Though as you say the writers were too timid to do anything really interesting with it.
- WorldMaker 5y ago
  I think all the EU things you just mentioned are their own versions of Force scope/power creep. The Sith Holocrons are very deeply implicated in some of the power creep in the EU. The lizards were added to fight a power creep in one book and then became their own obstacle that in turn caused new power creep in a later book. Luke's Jedi Academy turned out some OP members no better/worse than what the Disney era sequels did with Kylo Ren. The EU definitely isn't a great example for avoiding Force power creep, either. I'm not sure Star Wars has a good example. (In general I'm not sure much of fandom anywhere has a good long term cure for power creep: the stakes inflation race is a huge problem in almost every similar franchise, too. Avatar: TLA saw its own stakes inflation over the seasons and between the shows. DBZ is a classic case where stakes inflation just gets baked into the manga/anime's formats and assumed as a given for every storyline that follows. Comics both DC and Marvel have long struggled with it and their properties in other media such as films have done nothing but inherit it. And so forth…)

by mLuby 5y ago

missblit 5y ago

There are tons of ways to write a story involving the force that doesn't boil down to destiny or power creep. Jedi are essentially swordsmen / samurai / ronin characters; and not every swordsman needs to be in a hero villain pair. And there's plenty of fun stuff in the EU (Luke's Jedi academy, the force blocking Ysalamari lizards, Sith Holocrons, etc.) that could have been used to write a solid force-centric plot. Though as you say the writers were too timid to do anything really interesting with it.

WorldMaker 5y ago
I think all the EU things you just mentioned are their own versions of Force scope/power creep. The Sith Holocrons are very deeply implicated in some of the power creep in the EU. The lizards were added to fight a power creep in one book and then became their own obstacle that in turn caused new power creep in a later book. Luke's Jedi Academy turned out some OP members no better/worse than what the Disney era sequels did with Kylo Ren. The EU definitely isn't a great example for avoiding Force power creep, either. I'm not sure Star Wars has a good example. (In general I'm not sure much of fandom anywhere has a good long term cure for power creep: the stakes inflation race is a huge problem in almost every similar franchise, too. Avatar: TLA saw its own stakes inflation over the seasons and between the shows. DBZ is a classic case where stakes inflation just gets baked into the manga/anime's formats and assumed as a given for every storyline that follows. Comics both DC and Marvel have long struggled with it and their properties in other media such as films have done nothing but inherit it. And so forth…)