6 ms·

And yet, it is also considered that he has benefited more than harmed; simply by helping provide countless people with refrigeration.

ashtonkem 5y ago
That only works if we presume that the only way we could have discovered refrigeration was via CFCs, which seems improbable to me. My chest freezer uses propane as a refrigerant; why couldn’t we have just jumped straight to that?
- Baeocystin 5y ago
  We already had ammonia as a working fluid, and it's great at the job. Also a very toxic substance you do not want any significant quantity of in your home. The great strength of CFCs is how non-toxic/non-flammable they are compared to the alternatives.
  - jws 5y ago
    Speak for yourself! Back in the day my dorm fridge was an ammonia absorption unit. No compressor. Absolutely silent. Loved it. Perfect when living in 80 square feet.
- jws 5y ago
  Propane can be used as a refrigerant. It is cheap and performs reasonably well. The obvious downside is flammability. In the US the total charge for a propane fridge or AC is limited to 150 grams of propane. That is a rather small window unit. I think propane had to wait for precision manufacturing to be commoditized before it could be tolerated in living spaces. Leaking propane around switching electrical equipment can end badly.
mellavora 5y ago
because traditional methods of food preservation deserved to be abandoned? Your argument assumes refrigeration is a universal good, and other alternatives were not. Likewise, that the highly centralized food distribution system which became the defacto due to refrigeration is a universal good, while decentralized systems are not. such as the rich and varied food of Vietnam. https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2017/02/vietnams-low-tech-fermentation-food-system-takes-advantage-of-decay.html https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2017/02/vietnams-low-tech-fe...

6 ms·

And yet, it is also considered that he has benefited more than harmed; simply by helping provide countless people with refrigeration.

by jgtrosh 5y ago

ashtonkem 5y ago
That only works if we presume that the only way we could have discovered refrigeration was via CFCs, which seems improbable to me. My chest freezer uses propane as a refrigerant; why couldn’t we have just jumped straight to that?
- Baeocystin 5y ago
  We already had ammonia as a working fluid, and it's great at the job. Also a very toxic substance you do not want any significant quantity of in your home. The great strength of CFCs is how non-toxic/non-flammable they are compared to the alternatives.
  - jws 5y ago
    Speak for yourself! Back in the day my dorm fridge was an ammonia absorption unit. No compressor. Absolutely silent. Loved it. Perfect when living in 80 square feet.
- jws 5y ago
  Propane can be used as a refrigerant. It is cheap and performs reasonably well. The obvious downside is flammability. In the US the total charge for a propane fridge or AC is limited to 150 grams of propane. That is a rather small window unit. I think propane had to wait for precision manufacturing to be commoditized before it could be tolerated in living spaces. Leaking propane around switching electrical equipment can end badly.
mellavora 5y ago
because traditional methods of food preservation deserved to be abandoned? Your argument assumes refrigeration is a universal good, and other alternatives were not. Likewise, that the highly centralized food distribution system which became the defacto due to refrigeration is a universal good, while decentralized systems are not. such as the rich and varied food of Vietnam. https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2017/02/vietnams-low-tech-fermentation-food-system-takes-advantage-of-decay.html https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2017/02/vietnams-low-tech-fe...