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I don't understand the argument for vaccinating kids against Covid. Why force unnecessary medical treatment on them when they aren't at any significant risk?

conz 5y ago
I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting that we 'force unnecessary medical treatment' on kids. What is being made available to parents is the option to vaccinate their children if they deem it necessary. Also, while kids are less at risk of death or hospitalisation from COVID than adults, the risk is not insignificant: https://www.cnsnews.com/article/national/susan-jones/cdc-335-children-ages-17-and-under-have-died-covid-us-during-pandemic https://www.cnsnews.com/article/national/susan-jones/cdc-335... https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/child-covid-19-hospitalizations-new-high-august-2021-n1277119 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/child-covid-19-hospital... Regardless, COVID remains a much greater risk to kids than the vaccines: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/04/opinion/covid-vaccine-kids-risks.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/04/opinion/covid-vaccine-kid... Therefore, parents need to make up their own minds.
- guilhas 5y ago
  Except, at least in the UK, vaccinators will be in schools and will "evaluate" if the child is informed and competent to make the decision without parent consent. Mixed with financial incentives, for each child vaccinated, looks like a bad stance
  - conz 5y ago
    Except, at least in the UK, vaccinators will be in schools and will "evaluate" if the child is informed and competent to make the decision without parent consent. Mixed with financial incentives, for each child vaccinated, looks like a bad stance Vaccinations in schools are an absolute commonplace in Australia. Again, the proviso here is that no one is forcing the vaccinations on anyone. Incentives? Sure.
- errantmind 5y ago
  We'll have to disagree then on what is significant. 335 kids dying over the course of the pandemic is not to me: There are an estimated 78,720,000 kids in the US under the age of 18. That means 0.0004256% kids have died from Covid. To put that in perspective, more than half of that number died of the flu over the same period (not trying to compare all of covid to the flu). Also, overall, more than 10,000 kids under the age of 18 died of other causes.
blagie 5y ago
I don't understand why the argument of "significant risk" always hinges on odds of dying, rather than long-term complications. I also don't understand why people don't understand kids can be carriers, who do endanger others. I also don't understand why people don't understand that more COVID19 means more mutations. Even if the risk were low today, it might not be tomorrow. Vaccination is a cheap, effective public health measure.
- guilhas 5y ago
  So child sacrifice to save the old and sick?
  - blagie 5y ago
    A quick prick is now child sacrifice? Boy did I grow up in different times. We used to roughhouse, play in the woods, scrape our knees riding bikes, sword fight with sticks, have fights with gravel, and all sorts of other activities. Given the pain threshold of modern Americans, I'm not surprised America lost in Afghanistan. Right now, even wearing a mask is beyond the threshold of discomfort many Americans can tolerate. Not to mention the whole culture where if someone looks at someone funny, or says something sarcastic, it's "emotional abuse," and the victim needs therapy for PTSD. Wimps.
    - errantmind 5y ago
      I'm not sure you both are talking about the same thing. The argument has nothing to do with the pain of a "quick prick", nor people's physical pain tolerances. I also suspect (some) people are refusing to wear masks for reasons other than the physical discomfort. Speaking for myself, I grew up like you described, and still have a fairly large risk tolerance. I'm currently recovering from 'wounds' over a large portion of my body from outdoor activities. That doesn't mean I'm going push what I perceive to be unnecessary medical treatment on my hypothetical kids. The two are not mutually exclusive.
      - blagie 5y ago

conz 5y ago

I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting that we 'force unnecessary medical treatment' on kids. What is being made available to parents is the option to vaccinate their children if they deem it necessary. Also, while kids are less at risk of death or hospitalisation from COVID than adults, the risk is not insignificant: https://www.cnsnews.com/article/national/susan-jones/cdc-335-children-ages-17-and-under-have-died-covid-us-during-pandemic https://www.cnsnews.com/article/national/susan-jones/cdc-335... https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/child-covid-19-hospitalizations-new-high-august-2021-n1277119 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/child-covid-19-hospital... Regardless, COVID remains a much greater risk to kids than the vaccines: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/04/opinion/covid-vaccine-kids-risks.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/04/opinion/covid-vaccine-kid... Therefore, parents need to make up their own minds.

guilhas 5y ago
Except, at least in the UK, vaccinators will be in schools and will "evaluate" if the child is informed and competent to make the decision without parent consent. Mixed with financial incentives, for each child vaccinated, looks like a bad stance
- conz 5y ago
  Except, at least in the UK, vaccinators will be in schools and will "evaluate" if the child is informed and competent to make the decision without parent consent. Mixed with financial incentives, for each child vaccinated, looks like a bad stance Vaccinations in schools are an absolute commonplace in Australia. Again, the proviso here is that no one is forcing the vaccinations on anyone. Incentives? Sure.
errantmind 5y ago
We'll have to disagree then on what is significant. 335 kids dying over the course of the pandemic is not to me: There are an estimated 78,720,000 kids in the US under the age of 18. That means 0.0004256% kids have died from Covid. To put that in perspective, more than half of that number died of the flu over the same period (not trying to compare all of covid to the flu). Also, overall, more than 10,000 kids under the age of 18 died of other causes.

blagie 5y ago

I don't understand why the argument of "significant risk" always hinges on odds of dying, rather than long-term complications. I also don't understand why people don't understand kids can be carriers, who do endanger others. I also don't understand why people don't understand that more COVID19 means more mutations. Even if the risk were low today, it might not be tomorrow. Vaccination is a cheap, effective public health measure.

guilhas 5y ago
So child sacrifice to save the old and sick?
- blagie 5y ago
  A quick prick is now child sacrifice? Boy did I grow up in different times. We used to roughhouse, play in the woods, scrape our knees riding bikes, sword fight with sticks, have fights with gravel, and all sorts of other activities. Given the pain threshold of modern Americans, I'm not surprised America lost in Afghanistan. Right now, even wearing a mask is beyond the threshold of discomfort many Americans can tolerate. Not to mention the whole culture where if someone looks at someone funny, or says something sarcastic, it's "emotional abuse," and the victim needs therapy for PTSD. Wimps.
  - errantmind 5y ago
    I'm not sure you both are talking about the same thing. The argument has nothing to do with the pain of a "quick prick", nor people's physical pain tolerances. I also suspect (some) people are refusing to wear masks for reasons other than the physical discomfort. Speaking for myself, I grew up like you described, and still have a fairly large risk tolerance. I'm currently recovering from 'wounds' over a large portion of my body from outdoor activities. That doesn't mean I'm going push what I perceive to be unnecessary medical treatment on my hypothetical kids. The two are not mutually exclusive.
    - blagie 5y ago