4 ms·
In my opinion, this is actually a question of values. My position: absolutely not, but I take it as axiomatic that Microsoft (et al.) are incapable of any actua
by cybernautique 5y ago
In my opinion, this is actually a question of values. My position: absolutely not, but I take it as axiomatic that Microsoft (et al.) are incapable of any actual "good."
This is simply Window's attempt to build a new walled garden. If they were actually serious about advancing the state of civil computing, they'd make the NT core available as a microkernel that can be modularly placed into the Linux ecosystem. That is the _one_ thing I can think of which might raise my opinion of them (and I'm sure they lose sleep at night, knowing they haven't got my endorsement).
- p_j_w 5y agoI'm of a similar opinion. If they want to prove that they heart Linux, that's what they're going to have to do. Or, at the very least, document everything (including DX) so that the Wine devs can do their thing even if MS don't care to help. Until then, "MS <3 Linux" is nothing more than PR speak in my mind.
- cybernautique 5y agoAbsolutely agreed. Microsoft is not a pleasure to develop with, which is (in my opinion) a losing position with time. They see what Linux makes a pleasure, so they pursue the trappings of the community while damning the spirit of cooperation. Cynically, I see their moves as nothing more than an attempt to capture social capital. Hopefully, nobody is having the wool pulled over their eyes. Don't get me wrong: their incorporation of a TTY-like interface into CMD, and the Linuxification of Powershell, demonstrate the craftsmanship that Microsoft pride themselves on. It's good tech, but tainted. I will never trust Microsoft after the RDP fiasco.
- avodonosov 5y agoWhy this should be exactly microkernel?
- cybernautique 5y agoPerhaps it needn't be; I, with my negligible OS dev experience, just like microkernel architectures better. It seems more sensible to have microkernels managed by a microkernel loader. This might be an opinion I come to recant in time. The core of my position is that Microsoft needs to stop doing Microsoft things if they want to be taken seriously as a good faith actor, but I'm not holding my breath. Until they make moves to break down the walls of their garden, they're just another barrier.
- avodonosov 5y agoProviding POSIX and Linux-specific APIs does actually place them into Linux ecosystem. Programs bult for Linux suddenly can be run for Windows users. That's a boost in adoption potential for Linux programs (large part of the ecosystem). And adoption is very impotant for further development and success of software. On the other hand, for Linux users this makes Windows more attractive - why not choose Windows for your next laptop, if all your Linux software runs there. That undermines Linux userbase. But overall, I feel WSL is good for Linux.
- cybernautique 5y agoYeah, that's what gets me: it's obviously engineered to drive traffic one way without giving anything back to the community. I'm sorry, but I'm not interested in APIs to interact with a black box. Until Microsoft makes Windows user-controllable, I will never treat it with respect. I do see your point, however, and I hadn't thought it of that way; do you see anywhere the community might pick up on this for some benefit?
- avodonosov 5y agoMany ways. For example, it is more compelling to choose Linux as the target platform for new programs, because that way the program works both on Winoows an Linux. Therefore, more software for Linux world.
- ziml77 5y agoWSL is winning people over who had left Windows simply because the dev experience outside of the VS IDE is sub-par. We'll see what this means for Linux. It could mean that people start realizing that there's gaps between Windows and Linux that need to be closed to make Linux more attractive to users. Alternatively it could mean that people don't acknowledge those gaps and instead gripe about EEE. I know which outcome I'd put my money on.