4 ms·

Why nerds are unpopular?

13 points by gcmalloc 15y ago

blasdel 15y ago
Even now this is probably the single worst essay PG has ever published, and he's written some stinkers. Nerds weren't unpopular in school because they were actually even cooler than everyone else, and didn't want to waste their time stooping to everyone else's debased level of communication and friendship. That's an absurd fantasy. Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes, the kind of people that even 25 years later write essays about how really it was everybody else's fault that nobody got along with them. Very few nerds come to understand this, the only media I've seen that gets it right was this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reunion_(30_Rock) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reunion_(30_Rock)
- jamesaguilar 15y ago
  As one of those nerds who didn't get along with people as well as I wished in high school, I am kind of dreading the reunion. I have had a few awkward get-togethers with people I knew as a child before who remember me in ways I wish they didn't, but high school reunions are on a different scale. On the other hand, in some ways I relish the chance to show folks that I'm not the same as I was.
  - MostAwesomeDude 15y ago
    I don't think I'm going to go to my reunion. Nobody there will be interested in seeing me, and I don't feel like convincing people that I do anything worthwhile.
    - jamesaguilar 15y ago
      Hmm, I'm sorry about that. I know there are a few people that I want to see, which is the most important factor.
  - arctangent 15y ago
    I'm assuming you're from the US and that attending a school reunion is a big deal. But as a non-US person who didn't even attend his university graduation ceremony I urge you not to go if the idea bothers you in the slightest. Who gives a damn about those people you went to school with? Look forward to your future and all the interesting people you will meet there.
    - jamesaguilar 15y ago
      I give a damn about the people I went to school with. Sometimes it's possible for aspects of good experiences to be uncomfortable. C.f. the nervousness of a groom on his wedding day, or the experience of a soon-to-be-mother as she goes into labor.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
- pnathan 15y ago
  Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes Um.... no more than the rest of the human race. You're going to have to have some heavy-weight citations there.
- glimcat 15y ago
  Nerds are a lot like religious fundamentalists in this regard. They think they have privileged knowledge and think exposing others to it is a public service. Stereotypes about asocial behavior just feed into this. The fact that nerds are often more provably right than the fundies doesn't make it less annoying for those around them who aren't nearly as excited by strange doings with quark-gluon plasma and the minutia of decades-old television reruns. You can be right all you like, it doesn't mean anyone else cares.
- analyst74 15y ago
  I'm not sure how true PG's essay is in regards to American middle schools. But my limited understanding of societies confirms one of his central point: being social requires a lot of effort, being popular is a full-time job. Attitude has very little to do with it, I have lost count on how many people I've met who are both assholes and funny/charming.
  - dagw 15y ago
    Being universally popular may take a lot of effort, but simply not being disliked and generally getting on well enough with people doesn't. There is a huge spectrum between actively bullied and universally popular.
- jonathanaconway 15y ago
  I disagree totally with you, and somewhat with PG. School is a forced social setting, because they government makes it mandatory. The quality of teaching is pathetic, and kids are often bored out of their wits and given no direction. So what do you EXPECT to happen? Obviously a bunch of bored, totally uneducated, confused and bewildered individuals will try to bond with others and identify with a group/clique, primarily out of fear. So the athletes form a group, the druggies form a group and the nerds form a group. But because they're all forced together into these artificial "classes", with absent-minded teachers, they have problems getting on with eachother and the less popular ones get ostracised. If parents could choose where to school their children, if schools had to compete for customers like any other business, if teachers taught students properly and methodically, starting with basic laws of logic, the situation would be better. For one thing, youngsters would have greater self-esteem, and thus, could stand on their own much earlier, rather than defining themselves by their group/tribe. Also nerdy children could go to nerdy schools, where their talents could be appreciated and encouraged. Imagine how many more genuises could rise if they grew up in an atmosphere of encouragement and cooperation rather than hostility. I'm not saying nerds are "cooler" than everyone else. Cool is totally subjective. But if we had a private school system and better teachers, life would be easier for everyone, including nerds. The reason I loved the workforce so much, when I finally got into it, was that I had some choice in which companies I worked for, and I was able to strive for real-world objective goals, rather than being lumped into a random group of people, without any aim goal or direction.
  - atomicdog 15y ago
    >if schools had to compete for customers like any other business, if teachers taught students properly and methodically, starting with basic laws of logic, the situation would be better. You mean like privately-run British boarding schools? I think you'll find bullying is even worse in those kind of environments. Look up "fagging" on Wikipedia.
    - dagw 15y ago
      Having gone to a privately run British boarding school for 3 years, my experience was that, while there certainly was bullying, there was probably less of it than any other school I've been to. And while I'm not doubting that fagging happens, I never experienced it and I've never met anyone with personal first hand experience of it.
- atomicdog 15y ago
  >Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes, No, they're unpopular because western society tends to reward athletic prowess and has a stigma against intellectualism. They're unpopular because they are not seen to be "alpha males".
benatkin 15y ago
Repost of an old essay; Yahoo Answers style title. We can do better than this.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
uvTwitch 15y ago
I'd wager it also has much to do with nerds not knowing how to be 'dumb', and thus, not being able to forge meaningful connections with people of lesser mental capacity. Having interests and vocabularies that are alienating to people who struggle to keep up can often do just that.
- eropple 15y ago
  ...or it has a great deal to do with "nerds" acting like what you posited has any real basis in reality. Even 'dumb' people can smell a douche from a mile away. Probably better than the socially ill-equipped "nerds".
  - jamesaguilar 15y ago
    The other issue, at least at my school, was there were at least as many smart, non-nerd people as nerds. And nerds could be real fools. But nerds definitely have a habit of overestimating how smart they are compared to other people.
- Total_Meltdown 15y ago
  There was a comment earlier in this thread: > Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes, the kind of people that even 25 years later write essays about how really it was everybody else's fault that nobody got along with them. Get over your grudges, seriously. I bet the people who used to make fun of you don't even remember why. They'll run into you someday in the grocery store and go "Hey man, what's up? How's life?" Now you can either make a new friend, or stay in middle school where you still get picked on for your terrible social skills.
gte910h 15y ago
People who self identify as nerds never nerded out on being likable and sociable. They're skills that are easy to learn as anything is.

13 points by gcmalloc 15y ago

Even now this is probably the single worst essay PG has ever published, and he's written some stinkers. Nerds weren't unpopular in school because they were actually even cooler than everyone else, and didn't want to waste their time stooping to everyone else's debased level of communication and friendship. That's an absurd fantasy. Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes, the kind of people that even 25 years later write essays about how really it was everybody else's fault that nobody got along with them. Very few nerds come to understand this, the only media I've seen that gets it right was this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reunion_(30_Rock) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reunion_(30_Rock)

jamesaguilar 15y ago
As one of those nerds who didn't get along with people as well as I wished in high school, I am kind of dreading the reunion. I have had a few awkward get-togethers with people I knew as a child before who remember me in ways I wish they didn't, but high school reunions are on a different scale. On the other hand, in some ways I relish the chance to show folks that I'm not the same as I was.
- MostAwesomeDude 15y ago
  I don't think I'm going to go to my reunion. Nobody there will be interested in seeing me, and I don't feel like convincing people that I do anything worthwhile.
  - jamesaguilar 15y ago
    Hmm, I'm sorry about that. I know there are a few people that I want to see, which is the most important factor.
- arctangent 15y ago
  I'm assuming you're from the US and that attending a school reunion is a big deal. But as a non-US person who didn't even attend his university graduation ceremony I urge you not to go if the idea bothers you in the slightest. Who gives a damn about those people you went to school with? Look forward to your future and all the interesting people you will meet there.
  - jamesaguilar 15y ago
    I give a damn about the people I went to school with. Sometimes it's possible for aspects of good experiences to be uncomfortable. C.f. the nervousness of a groom on his wedding day, or the experience of a soon-to-be-mother as she goes into labor.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
pnathan 15y ago
Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes Um.... no more than the rest of the human race. You're going to have to have some heavy-weight citations there.
glimcat 15y ago
Nerds are a lot like religious fundamentalists in this regard. They think they have privileged knowledge and think exposing others to it is a public service. Stereotypes about asocial behavior just feed into this. The fact that nerds are often more provably right than the fundies doesn't make it less annoying for those around them who aren't nearly as excited by strange doings with quark-gluon plasma and the minutia of decades-old television reruns. You can be right all you like, it doesn't mean anyone else cares.
analyst74 15y ago
I'm not sure how true PG's essay is in regards to American middle schools. But my limited understanding of societies confirms one of his central point: being social requires a lot of effort, being popular is a full-time job. Attitude has very little to do with it, I have lost count on how many people I've met who are both assholes and funny/charming.
- dagw 15y ago
  Being universally popular may take a lot of effort, but simply not being disliked and generally getting on well enough with people doesn't. There is a huge spectrum between actively bullied and universally popular.
jonathanaconway 15y ago
I disagree totally with you, and somewhat with PG. School is a forced social setting, because they government makes it mandatory. The quality of teaching is pathetic, and kids are often bored out of their wits and given no direction. So what do you EXPECT to happen? Obviously a bunch of bored, totally uneducated, confused and bewildered individuals will try to bond with others and identify with a group/clique, primarily out of fear. So the athletes form a group, the druggies form a group and the nerds form a group. But because they're all forced together into these artificial "classes", with absent-minded teachers, they have problems getting on with eachother and the less popular ones get ostracised. If parents could choose where to school their children, if schools had to compete for customers like any other business, if teachers taught students properly and methodically, starting with basic laws of logic, the situation would be better. For one thing, youngsters would have greater self-esteem, and thus, could stand on their own much earlier, rather than defining themselves by their group/tribe. Also nerdy children could go to nerdy schools, where their talents could be appreciated and encouraged. Imagine how many more genuises could rise if they grew up in an atmosphere of encouragement and cooperation rather than hostility. I'm not saying nerds are "cooler" than everyone else. Cool is totally subjective. But if we had a private school system and better teachers, life would be easier for everyone, including nerds. The reason I loved the workforce so much, when I finally got into it, was that I had some choice in which companies I worked for, and I was able to strive for real-world objective goals, rather than being lumped into a random group of people, without any aim goal or direction.
- atomicdog 15y ago
  >if schools had to compete for customers like any other business, if teachers taught students properly and methodically, starting with basic laws of logic, the situation would be better. You mean like privately-run British boarding schools? I think you'll find bullying is even worse in those kind of environments. Look up "fagging" on Wikipedia.
  - dagw 15y ago
    Having gone to a privately run British boarding school for 3 years, my experience was that, while there certainly was bullying, there was probably less of it than any other school I've been to. And while I'm not doubting that fagging happens, I never experienced it and I've never met anyone with personal first hand experience of it.
atomicdog 15y ago
>Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes, No, they're unpopular because western society tends to reward athletic prowess and has a stigma against intellectualism. They're unpopular because they are not seen to be "alpha males".

benatkin 15y ago

Repost of an old essay; Yahoo Answers style title. We can do better than this.

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

uvTwitch 15y ago

I'd wager it also has much to do with nerds not knowing how to be 'dumb', and thus, not being able to forge meaningful connections with people of lesser mental capacity. Having interests and vocabularies that are alienating to people who struggle to keep up can often do just that.

eropple 15y ago
...or it has a great deal to do with "nerds" acting like what you posited has any real basis in reality. Even 'dumb' people can smell a douche from a mile away. Probably better than the socially ill-equipped "nerds".
- jamesaguilar 15y ago
  The other issue, at least at my school, was there were at least as many smart, non-nerd people as nerds. And nerds could be real fools. But nerds definitely have a habit of overestimating how smart they are compared to other people.
Total_Meltdown 15y ago
There was a comment earlier in this thread: > Nerds are unpopular in forced social settings like secondary schools because they're huge assholes, the kind of people that even 25 years later write essays about how really it was everybody else's fault that nobody got along with them. Get over your grudges, seriously. I bet the people who used to make fun of you don't even remember why. They'll run into you someday in the grocery store and go "Hey man, what's up? How's life?" Now you can either make a new friend, or stay in middle school where you still get picked on for your terrible social skills.

gte910h 15y ago

People who self identify as nerds never nerded out on being likable and sociable. They're skills that are easy to learn as anything is.