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It should be. It’s that and/or recapturing the carbon, purely from a logical perspective. But that doesn’t seem to be obvious to every climate activist I ever
by codeflo 5y ago
It should be. It’s that and/or recapturing the carbon, purely from a logical perspective.
But that doesn’t seem to be obvious to every climate activist I ever discussed with, at least a dozen at this point, who would suggest a zillion interventions and regulations, none of which would keep even a tiny bit of fossil fuel unburnt. The climate doesn’t care whether the carbon is released in America or Africa, or whether it’s done for moral or immoral purposes.
Is there a rational climate movement somewhere that one can join? Asking for a friend.
- pastage 5y agoNot sure who you are arguing with, all climate activist I talk to strive to zero fossil fuels. Implicitly calling people irrational tends to only get you troll responses.
- codeflo 5y agoThat’s the obvious goal, but what kinds of concrete demands do you hear? I’m trying not to set up straw-men, but I only get things like banning combustion cars and banning plastics. None of which would incentivize the Saudis to pump even one less barrel from the ground. The oil would just go elsewhere for a price that might be slightly less, but is still a very large factor of the production costs. If one doesn’t realize that, one might implement lots of policies that “feel good”, are very expensive in terms of standards of living, but have no net effect on the climate.
- esarbe 5y agoHow about we start getting rid of subsidies for fossil fuels, direct and indirect? That's just one, I've got more. https://www.eurekalert.org/news-releases/923668 https://www.eurekalert.org/news-releases/923668 https://www.eesi.org/papers/view/fact-sheet-fossil-fuel-subsidies-a-closer-look-at-tax-breaks-and-societal-costs https://www.eesi.org/papers/view/fact-sheet-fossil-fuel-subs...
- streamofdigits 5y agowe should probably retire the term "climate activist". 1) the association with "activism" suggests fringe / special interests and indirectly inserts political friction in deadly serious issues that are truly global and affect all of us. 2) the sustainability issues we are facing are not just about climate (and the obsession with CO2 in particular might turn counterproductive if other risks get under-reported). e.g. it is almost certain that our direction of travel does not leave room for any other major species besides domesticated ones (and those we can't eradicate like viruses and cockroaches). in same vain, our general pollution footprint (plastic, agrichemicals etc) steadily degrades the environment we all live in. sustainability is a broad and mainstream concern and we should reframe it as such if we honestly want to find solutions.
- codeflo 5y agoOr to put it another way, because climate is now a concern that most informed people share, there’s a strategy by some political groups to try to smuggle in other, somewhat less popular demands under the same umbrella: from wildlife protection to deindustrialization to social issues.
- streamofdigits 5y agoThe problem is that any important action on climate change triggers immediately some linked social issue. from coal miners, to Amazon rainforest logging, to people resisting wind turbines in their backyard, you name it. These frictions are not trivial to resolve. The bigger issue we face is how to invent functioning (problem solving) politics, both within and between countries
- tjansen 5y agohttps://www.emergencyreactor.org https://www.emergencyreactor.org ?
- esarbe 5y agoHow about these guys: https://rebellion.global/ https://rebellion.global/ ?