4 ms·

Not 3 year olds perhaps, but there is definitely an organized movement to promote early gender affirmation surgery.

by zepto 5y ago

smt88 5y ago
No, there isn't. Think about what you're saying. Why would anyone want to promote a particular surgery? The movement is for individual freedom and for the government to stay out of people's medical decisions. Will it increase the number of those surgeries for adults if the government stops discouraging them? Maybe, maybe not. The point is that there is no "public interest" in what genitalia someone needs to have according to (again) their doctors.
- zepto 5y ago
  > Think about what you're saying. Why would anyone want to promote a particular surgery? That’s obvious - the good faith interpretation is that they believe that people have bodies that don’t match their gender and that having surgery sooner will spare them from suffering than having it later. > The movement is for individual freedom and for the government to stay out of people's medical decisions. No it isn’t. The movement is about denying parents the right to make medical decisions for their children. > Will it increase the number of those surgeries for adults if the government stops discouraging them? Maybe, maybe not. This is a non-sequitur. > The point is that there is no "public interest" in what genitalia someone needs to have according to (again) their doctors. There is public interest in protecting children from people who would encourage them to have irreversible surgery that renders them sterile when there is no evidence that this is medically necessary. > The point is that there is no "public interest" in what genitalia someone needs to have according to (again) their doctors. Why are doctors deciding that minors with healthy genitalia need to have them surgically altered?
  - smt88 5y ago
    You're regurgitating lies invented by the religious right, whether you realize it or not. > No it isn’t. The movement is about denying parents the right to make medical decisions for their children. This is absolutely, 100% false. There is no substantial, mainstream group advocating for this. This is the subject of conservative misinformation[1]. > There is public interest in protecting children from people who would encourage them to have irreversible surgery that renders them sterile when there is no evidence that this is medically necessary. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN[2]. Children cannot get irreversible surgery in the US. They may be given puberty blockers, which are completely reversible, and only until they're adults and able to make a decision for themselves. And none of this happens without the consent of a board-certified physician who is under oath (and the threat of lawsuit and/or losing malpractice insurance) not to do anything to harm the patient. > Why are doctors deciding that minors with healthy genitalia need to have them surgically altered? What the actual fuck are you talking about? Do you also believe that there are thousands of partial birth abortions in this country? Doctors do not decide this or perform this surgery in the US. Also, wait until you hear about circumcision. You're going to be really outraged at the surgical alteration of minors with healthy genitalia then! 1. https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-rachel-levine-reassignment/factcheckdr-rachel-levine-during-hearingdid-notconfirm-or-deny-supportfor-children-having-gender-reassignment-surgery-without-parentalconsent-idUSKCN2AU1XD https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-rachel-levine-r... 2. https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/05/viral-image/no-young-children-cannot-take-hormones-or-change-t/#:~:text=Hormone%20treatment%20for%20feminization%20or,at%20least%2016%20years%20old.&text=Gender%20reassignment%20surgery%20is%20typically,older%20in%20the%20United%20States https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/05/viral-imag....
    - zepto 5y ago
      > There is no substantial, mainstream group advocating for this. No true Scotsman is transgender, either. > This is the subject of conservative misinformation[1]. It’s also the subject of high quality investigative reporting: https://www.amazon.com/Irreversible-Damage-Transgender-Seducing-Daughters/dp/1684510317 https://www.amazon.com/Irreversible-Damage-Transgender-Seduc... > Children cannot get irreversible surgery in the US. They may be given puberty blockers, which are completely reversible The effect of delaying puberty until adulthood is irreversible and we don’t have studies that rule out long term side effects. > and only until they're adults and able to make a decision for themselves. Ok - so the decision to medically alter the course of their development is made for them, at a time when you admit they are not able to decide for themselves. > And none of this happens without the consent of a board-certified physician who is under oath (and the threat of lawsuit and/or losing malpractice insurance) not to do anything to harm the patient. Which is increasingly happening in other countries. And why does a doctor get to make this decision without the parents? > Why are doctors deciding that minors with healthy genitalia need to have them surgically altered? > Also, wait until you hear about circumcision. You're going to be really outraged at the surgical alteration of minors with healthy genitalia then! I am in fact outraged at the practice of circumcision. Aren’t you?

Not 3 year olds perhaps, but there is definitely an organized movement to promote early gender affirmation surgery.

by zepto 5y ago

Not 3 year olds perhaps, but there is definitely an organized movement to promote early gender affirmation surgery.

No, there isn't. Think about what you're saying. Why would anyone want to promote a particular surgery? The movement is for individual freedom and for the government to stay out of people's medical decisions. Will it increase the number of those surgeries for adults if the government stops discouraging them? Maybe, maybe not. The point is that there is no "public interest" in what genitalia someone needs to have according to (again) their doctors.

zepto 5y ago
> Think about what you're saying. Why would anyone want to promote a particular surgery? That’s obvious - the good faith interpretation is that they believe that people have bodies that don’t match their gender and that having surgery sooner will spare them from suffering than having it later. > The movement is for individual freedom and for the government to stay out of people's medical decisions. No it isn’t. The movement is about denying parents the right to make medical decisions for their children. > Will it increase the number of those surgeries for adults if the government stops discouraging them? Maybe, maybe not. This is a non-sequitur. > The point is that there is no "public interest" in what genitalia someone needs to have according to (again) their doctors. There is public interest in protecting children from people who would encourage them to have irreversible surgery that renders them sterile when there is no evidence that this is medically necessary. > The point is that there is no "public interest" in what genitalia someone needs to have according to (again) their doctors. Why are doctors deciding that minors with healthy genitalia need to have them surgically altered?
- smt88 5y ago
  You're regurgitating lies invented by the religious right, whether you realize it or not. > No it isn’t. The movement is about denying parents the right to make medical decisions for their children. This is absolutely, 100% false. There is no substantial, mainstream group advocating for this. This is the subject of conservative misinformation[1]. > There is public interest in protecting children from people who would encourage them to have irreversible surgery that renders them sterile when there is no evidence that this is medically necessary. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN[2]. Children cannot get irreversible surgery in the US. They may be given puberty blockers, which are completely reversible, and only until they're adults and able to make a decision for themselves. And none of this happens without the consent of a board-certified physician who is under oath (and the threat of lawsuit and/or losing malpractice insurance) not to do anything to harm the patient. > Why are doctors deciding that minors with healthy genitalia need to have them surgically altered? What the actual fuck are you talking about? Do you also believe that there are thousands of partial birth abortions in this country? Doctors do not decide this or perform this surgery in the US. Also, wait until you hear about circumcision. You're going to be really outraged at the surgical alteration of minors with healthy genitalia then! 1. https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-rachel-levine-reassignment/factcheckdr-rachel-levine-during-hearingdid-notconfirm-or-deny-supportfor-children-having-gender-reassignment-surgery-without-parentalconsent-idUSKCN2AU1XD https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-rachel-levine-r... 2. https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/05/viral-image/no-young-children-cannot-take-hormones-or-change-t/#:~:text=Hormone%20treatment%20for%20feminization%20or,at%20least%2016%20years%20old.&text=Gender%20reassignment%20surgery%20is%20typically,older%20in%20the%20United%20States https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/05/viral-imag....
  - zepto 5y ago
    > There is no substantial, mainstream group advocating for this. No true Scotsman is transgender, either. > This is the subject of conservative misinformation[1]. It’s also the subject of high quality investigative reporting: https://www.amazon.com/Irreversible-Damage-Transgender-Seducing-Daughters/dp/1684510317 https://www.amazon.com/Irreversible-Damage-Transgender-Seduc... > Children cannot get irreversible surgery in the US. They may be given puberty blockers, which are completely reversible The effect of delaying puberty until adulthood is irreversible and we don’t have studies that rule out long term side effects. > and only until they're adults and able to make a decision for themselves. Ok - so the decision to medically alter the course of their development is made for them, at a time when you admit they are not able to decide for themselves. > And none of this happens without the consent of a board-certified physician who is under oath (and the threat of lawsuit and/or losing malpractice insurance) not to do anything to harm the patient. Which is increasingly happening in other countries. And why does a doctor get to make this decision without the parents? > Why are doctors deciding that minors with healthy genitalia need to have them surgically altered? > Also, wait until you hear about circumcision. You're going to be really outraged at the surgical alteration of minors with healthy genitalia then! I am in fact outraged at the practice of circumcision. Aren’t you?