4 ms·

Miegakure Update September 2021

80 points by doppp 5y ago

Scaevolus 5y ago
There's a curious psychological effect where talking about your plans and receiving anticipatory praise can decrease motivation. It's part of the general way that extrinsic motivations poison intrinsic motivations. Shipping is hard.
- bomdo 5y ago
  To add insult to injury, writing a press release like this (even including a screenshot with the very latest stuff) can feel just as good as actually shipping. At this point, eclipsing the story of "the cool game that never shipped" with an actual game is a very high bar indeed.
- reedf1 5y ago
  Exactly - you are robbing your dopamine reward loop by "stealing" the dopamine hit usually reserved for accomplishment or achievement with the comparatively easy and low-effort social reward of stating your aspirations.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- jan_Inkepa 5y ago
  I'm not sure where this thread of psychologising is coming from. It feels very peculiar. I think you have to be pretty motivated to work on an unreleased game for a decade (and make consistent progress over that period). I think doubting the team's motivations, intrinsic or otherwise, is misplaced here. Working on a project essentially in private for a long time can be really draining to the motivations. Being able to be a bit open about parts of it can help a lot with motivation for development. Yes there are possible second-order effects of games getting warped depending on external factors, but I don't see any evidence of that here. The team is making progress towards making a game they want to make.
- fouric 5y ago
  There was a post on HN a few years ago that I believe linked to scientific evidence of this, but unfortunately I cannot find that post, nor do I remember the specific terminology that the paper(s) used.
Zhyl 5y ago
I look forward to being able to play the game. It's in an unusual position of being on my list of games I've been following for about a decade now, but without being released, cancelled, experiencing notable delays (as far as 'dead time' is concerned) or having a significant change in purpose or scope. Marc has just been working away, methodically, patiently, making the game that he wants to make.
Uehreka 5y ago
Normally I’d be pretty pissed at a game like this that’s been “coming soon!” for a decade, but I’m not, and here’s why: The developer has not taken people’s money. Unlike things like Star Citizen, whatever decisions are leading to this project’s extended timeline aren’t putting backers at risk of receiving nothing if things go pear shaped. Miegakure’s developer doesn’t seem to have sought to monetize the crap out of the hype he generated in the early 2010s, and as a result I’m cool with him taking as long as he wants (or even walking away, though it would make me quite sad). [EDIT] I know Star Citizen has started “delivering” recently. I still think the way they raised money and built the game was not a good model for others to follow.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  Has it only been since 2010? I could have sworn I was first hearing about Miegakure in, like, 2003.
  - Impossible 5y ago
    Miegakure was first shown at GDC in 2009. The first blog entry is also April 2009, so not as early as 2003, but it definitely began development in the late 2000s. It's been at least 12 years in development
    - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
      I can't recall where I first saw it, I think it was linked by this Linux gaming site (happy penguin?), or maybe it was some gamedev site. Anyway it might have been 2009, both years seem equally forever ago to me.
      - josephcsible 5y ago
        Here, perhaps? https://xkcd.com/721/ https://xkcd.com/721/
      - poetaster 5y ago
        Genius. Thanks flat guy.
hwers 5y ago
Just curious: are there other games people (who are reading this) have been waiting for for like 10 years that show a lot of promise and people are excited about? It used to be The Witness for me but then that released and now there's not much to replace it (other than this game maybe). It's kind of a nice delayed gratification exercise.
- Zhyl 5y ago
  Taiji [1] springs to mind. It's very Witness-like in its mechanics and methods of conveying information. It's only been a short time (3-4 years) compared to the Witness (7 years) and Miegekure (12 years), but it looks like it might not be out for a while. The developer does post a lot of updates, though, so it's clear development is ongoing. Jonathan Blow also has his untitled Sokoban game which he shows on Twitch [2] (5 years). I was also waiting for Infinity: The Quest for Earth [3] for about 12 years before they pivoted to being a battle arena rather than an open-world game like Elite Dangerous or No-Man's Sky. [1] https://taiji-game.com/ https://taiji-game.com/ [2] https://twitch.tv/j_blow https://twitch.tv/j_blow [3] https://inovaestudios.com/Battlescape https://inovaestudios.com/Battlescape
- spatulon 5y ago
  I remember Memory of a Broken Dimension piquing my interest many years ago, and I believe it's still in development. I see the creator streaming development on Twitch pretty regularly. https://store.steampowered.com/app/544300/Memory_of_a_Broken_Dimension/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/544300/Memory_of_a_Broken... Back in the day, Team Fortress 2 and Duke Nukem Forever were the butts of many vapourware jokes, but they were both eventually released. The prolonged development seemed to help one of them more than the other, though.

80 points by doppp 5y ago

There's a curious psychological effect where talking about your plans and receiving anticipatory praise can decrease motivation. It's part of the general way that extrinsic motivations poison intrinsic motivations. Shipping is hard.

bomdo 5y ago
To add insult to injury, writing a press release like this (even including a screenshot with the very latest stuff) can feel just as good as actually shipping. At this point, eclipsing the story of "the cool game that never shipped" with an actual game is a very high bar indeed.
reedf1 5y ago
Exactly - you are robbing your dopamine reward loop by "stealing" the dopamine hit usually reserved for accomplishment or achievement with the comparatively easy and low-effort social reward of stating your aspirations.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
jan_Inkepa 5y ago
I'm not sure where this thread of psychologising is coming from. It feels very peculiar. I think you have to be pretty motivated to work on an unreleased game for a decade (and make consistent progress over that period). I think doubting the team's motivations, intrinsic or otherwise, is misplaced here. Working on a project essentially in private for a long time can be really draining to the motivations. Being able to be a bit open about parts of it can help a lot with motivation for development. Yes there are possible second-order effects of games getting warped depending on external factors, but I don't see any evidence of that here. The team is making progress towards making a game they want to make.
fouric 5y ago
There was a post on HN a few years ago that I believe linked to scientific evidence of this, but unfortunately I cannot find that post, nor do I remember the specific terminology that the paper(s) used.

Zhyl 5y ago

I look forward to being able to play the game. It's in an unusual position of being on my list of games I've been following for about a decade now, but without being released, cancelled, experiencing notable delays (as far as 'dead time' is concerned) or having a significant change in purpose or scope. Marc has just been working away, methodically, patiently, making the game that he wants to make.

Uehreka 5y ago

Normally I’d be pretty pissed at a game like this that’s been “coming soon!” for a decade, but I’m not, and here’s why: The developer has not taken people’s money. Unlike things like Star Citizen, whatever decisions are leading to this project’s extended timeline aren’t putting backers at risk of receiving nothing if things go pear shaped. Miegakure’s developer doesn’t seem to have sought to monetize the crap out of the hype he generated in the early 2010s, and as a result I’m cool with him taking as long as he wants (or even walking away, though it would make me quite sad). [EDIT] I know Star Citizen has started “delivering” recently. I still think the way they raised money and built the game was not a good model for others to follow.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
Has it only been since 2010? I could have sworn I was first hearing about Miegakure in, like, 2003.
- Impossible 5y ago
  Miegakure was first shown at GDC in 2009. The first blog entry is also April 2009, so not as early as 2003, but it definitely began development in the late 2000s. It's been at least 12 years in development
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
    I can't recall where I first saw it, I think it was linked by this Linux gaming site (happy penguin?), or maybe it was some gamedev site. Anyway it might have been 2009, both years seem equally forever ago to me.
    - josephcsible 5y ago
      Here, perhaps? https://xkcd.com/721/ https://xkcd.com/721/
    - poetaster 5y ago
      Genius. Thanks flat guy.

hwers 5y ago

Just curious: are there other games people (who are reading this) have been waiting for for like 10 years that show a lot of promise and people are excited about? It used to be The Witness for me but then that released and now there's not much to replace it (other than this game maybe). It's kind of a nice delayed gratification exercise.

Zhyl 5y ago
Taiji [1] springs to mind. It's very Witness-like in its mechanics and methods of conveying information. It's only been a short time (3-4 years) compared to the Witness (7 years) and Miegekure (12 years), but it looks like it might not be out for a while. The developer does post a lot of updates, though, so it's clear development is ongoing. Jonathan Blow also has his untitled Sokoban game which he shows on Twitch [2] (5 years). I was also waiting for Infinity: The Quest for Earth [3] for about 12 years before they pivoted to being a battle arena rather than an open-world game like Elite Dangerous or No-Man's Sky. [1] https://taiji-game.com/ https://taiji-game.com/ [2] https://twitch.tv/j_blow https://twitch.tv/j_blow [3] https://inovaestudios.com/Battlescape https://inovaestudios.com/Battlescape
spatulon 5y ago
I remember Memory of a Broken Dimension piquing my interest many years ago, and I believe it's still in development. I see the creator streaming development on Twitch pretty regularly. https://store.steampowered.com/app/544300/Memory_of_a_Broken_Dimension/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/544300/Memory_of_a_Broken... Back in the day, Team Fortress 2 and Duke Nukem Forever were the butts of many vapourware jokes, but they were both eventually released. The prolonged development seemed to help one of them more than the other, though.