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…or we could simply stop emitting greenhouse gases. Like, right now.

boublepop 5y ago
Stanley wrote on his greenhouse gas powered device from the comfort of his greenhouse gas powered office environment at his greenhouse gas powered employer that his favorite greenhouse gas powered transportation vehicle had brought him to, while slacking of from his day job which was to significantly increased the life quality of millions of people while emitting greenhouse gases. I think you’ve found a great solution. Unfortunately it only works for spherical cows in a vacuum.
- gefhfff 5y ago
  Well, generate the gas with renewables
- myrmidon 5y ago
  What a load of crap. Sure, everyone reading and responding to this did profit from CO2 emissions for sure, but reducing emissions without going back to the stone-age is perfectly possible and this should be clear to anyone: We could simply start taxing Co2 emissions, which would boost renewable energy buildout INSTANTLY: One example: Right now, electricity (and concrete) are DIRT cheap-- my electricity bill is a complete joke compared to e.g. groceries (or mobile data, even). Significant electricity costs (like 1$/kwh) would definitely help reduce emissions, and this could easily be done in a way that would not completely ruin the poorer half of the population by moving other taxes correspondingly. This is just not done because people (and their governments) simply don't care enough (still!).
  - FredPret 5y ago
    Uhhhh, no. What about electricity that goes into mining and manufacturing? If you raise the price of that, all goods become more expensive, from the simple Mars bar up to construction. The poor will be decimated.
    - mavhc 5y ago
      Companies will compete to find ways to produce things with less pollution if they can't cheat and pollute without paying. And other companies will compete to find cheaper ways to remove pollution, lowering costs for those who pollute.
    - pessimizer 5y ago
      The poor are decimated when we allow them to be, not when prices rise by 50%.
      - FredPret 5y ago
        OK, let’s jack up prices for everything from food to infrastructure but in a magical way that doesn’t harm low-income people. Great plan bro
        asd4232 5y ago
        Bruh here in Europe there's a thing called welfare state. The gov can pay poor people to compensate.
        FredPret 5y ago
        Another fantastic idea. Get free money from somewhere and simply give it to poor people, so they can stop being poor. That way we can tax the crap out of all those productive people people and companies over there without worrying about any economic consequences.
    - myrmidon 5y ago
      > If you raise the price of that, all goods become more expensive, from the simple Mars bar up to construction. You can just change e.g. income tax accordingly so expected tax load stays the same-- only now your citizens are financially incentivized to save electricity... Also you have a convenient excuse (as nation state) for protectionist import tariffs hitting all countries that don't practise Co2 taxation themselves (which might be nice for local economy)
  - silverberry 5y ago
    I'm sorry to be this blunt but you're completely out of touch with reality. In the whole of Europe electricity prices are currently through the roof, marking records on many countries... daily. [edit: mostly because CO2 emission taxes and because gas producing countries can charge whatever they want because the whole continent (but France) depends on them] Just because people (normal everyday working-class) people pay higher prices everyday for what they need to live, electricity doesn't come from cleaner sources suddenly; and it sure won't in the short/medium term. We are decarbonizing but in the meantime we have to use gas; the other alternatives (eg: nuclear, which is currently the only solution) are expensive as f* and take a looong time to be build. Renewables are not constant and there lies the problem, they also need a lot of ground allotted to be installed and account for a reasonable part of a country's usage. We're stuck deep and there's no easy or quick way out. It also isn't "people just don't want to", people can't. Electric cars are very expensive to be adopted massively, and if they were comomn, the energy wouldn't be clean anyway, we have to change the infrastucture. Where do you suggest we get the energy from? There are no easy and quick solutions.
    - asd4232 5y ago
      It would already have a significant impact if people stopped (most likely against their own will) buying anything they don't really need. Brainless consumerism, buying material stuff simply because it makes you feel good for a while should be stopped through global government intervention. The amount of clothes, electronics, food and such that gets wasted is just enormous on our societies. Only places in the world where people live somewhat ecologically are those where they simply can't afford such waste. So, IMO everything that isn't a basic necessity should be made much more expensive to force people rethink their consumption habits.
    - myrmidon 5y ago
      > In the whole of Europe electricity prices are currently through the roof If by "through the roof" you mean like 30cents/kWh, then thats exactly what I'm talking about: if you don't have a farm of bitcoin miners at home your electricity bill is bound to be a complete joke compared to groceries, rent or even mobile data. If we had actually expensive electricity (and car fuel and concrete etc.), which could easily be compensated by e.g. income or even sales tax modifications, then people would have ACTUAL financial incentive to buy efficient fridges or bike to work (without any additional burden).
goatlover 5y ago
So we turn off power plants, stop manufacturing, and people all over the world stop driving, shipping, farming and flying with anything that emits C02. What do you suppose happens after that?
- jellicle 5y ago
  The US has been spending a couple hundred million dollars per day on the war in Afghanistan alone for the last 20 years. No one even noticed. If the US put its mind to it (WWII levels of mobilization), it could probably achieve full renewable electrical conversion (all fossil fuel infrastructure obsoleted and removed) within five years or so.
  - aidenn0 5y ago
    There are 300 million people in the US, so "A couple hundred million dollars per day" is less than 1 dollar per person, per day. At $1 per person per day, it would take a lot of days to convert everyone to full renewable.

Stanley wrote on his greenhouse gas powered device from the comfort of his greenhouse gas powered office environment at his greenhouse gas powered employer that his favorite greenhouse gas powered transportation vehicle had brought him to, while slacking of from his day job which was to significantly increased the life quality of millions of people while emitting greenhouse gases. I think you’ve found a great solution. Unfortunately it only works for spherical cows in a vacuum.

gefhfff 5y ago
Well, generate the gas with renewables
myrmidon 5y ago
What a load of crap. Sure, everyone reading and responding to this did profit from CO2 emissions for sure, but reducing emissions without going back to the stone-age is perfectly possible and this should be clear to anyone: We could simply start taxing Co2 emissions, which would boost renewable energy buildout INSTANTLY: One example: Right now, electricity (and concrete) are DIRT cheap-- my electricity bill is a complete joke compared to e.g. groceries (or mobile data, even). Significant electricity costs (like 1$/kwh) would definitely help reduce emissions, and this could easily be done in a way that would not completely ruin the poorer half of the population by moving other taxes correspondingly. This is just not done because people (and their governments) simply don't care enough (still!).
- FredPret 5y ago
  Uhhhh, no. What about electricity that goes into mining and manufacturing? If you raise the price of that, all goods become more expensive, from the simple Mars bar up to construction. The poor will be decimated.
  - mavhc 5y ago
    Companies will compete to find ways to produce things with less pollution if they can't cheat and pollute without paying. And other companies will compete to find cheaper ways to remove pollution, lowering costs for those who pollute.
  - pessimizer 5y ago
    The poor are decimated when we allow them to be, not when prices rise by 50%.
    - FredPret 5y ago
      OK, let’s jack up prices for everything from food to infrastructure but in a magical way that doesn’t harm low-income people. Great plan bro
      - asd4232 5y ago
        Bruh here in Europe there's a thing called welfare state. The gov can pay poor people to compensate.
        FredPret 5y ago
        Another fantastic idea. Get free money from somewhere and simply give it to poor people, so they can stop being poor. That way we can tax the crap out of all those productive people people and companies over there without worrying about any economic consequences.
  - myrmidon 5y ago
    > If you raise the price of that, all goods become more expensive, from the simple Mars bar up to construction. You can just change e.g. income tax accordingly so expected tax load stays the same-- only now your citizens are financially incentivized to save electricity... Also you have a convenient excuse (as nation state) for protectionist import tariffs hitting all countries that don't practise Co2 taxation themselves (which might be nice for local economy)
- silverberry 5y ago
  I'm sorry to be this blunt but you're completely out of touch with reality. In the whole of Europe electricity prices are currently through the roof, marking records on many countries... daily. [edit: mostly because CO2 emission taxes and because gas producing countries can charge whatever they want because the whole continent (but France) depends on them] Just because people (normal everyday working-class) people pay higher prices everyday for what they need to live, electricity doesn't come from cleaner sources suddenly; and it sure won't in the short/medium term. We are decarbonizing but in the meantime we have to use gas; the other alternatives (eg: nuclear, which is currently the only solution) are expensive as f* and take a looong time to be build. Renewables are not constant and there lies the problem, they also need a lot of ground allotted to be installed and account for a reasonable part of a country's usage. We're stuck deep and there's no easy or quick way out. It also isn't "people just don't want to", people can't. Electric cars are very expensive to be adopted massively, and if they were comomn, the energy wouldn't be clean anyway, we have to change the infrastucture. Where do you suggest we get the energy from? There are no easy and quick solutions.
  - asd4232 5y ago
    It would already have a significant impact if people stopped (most likely against their own will) buying anything they don't really need. Brainless consumerism, buying material stuff simply because it makes you feel good for a while should be stopped through global government intervention. The amount of clothes, electronics, food and such that gets wasted is just enormous on our societies. Only places in the world where people live somewhat ecologically are those where they simply can't afford such waste. So, IMO everything that isn't a basic necessity should be made much more expensive to force people rethink their consumption habits.
  - myrmidon 5y ago
    > In the whole of Europe electricity prices are currently through the roof If by "through the roof" you mean like 30cents/kWh, then thats exactly what I'm talking about: if you don't have a farm of bitcoin miners at home your electricity bill is bound to be a complete joke compared to groceries, rent or even mobile data. If we had actually expensive electricity (and car fuel and concrete etc.), which could easily be compensated by e.g. income or even sales tax modifications, then people would have ACTUAL financial incentive to buy efficient fridges or bike to work (without any additional burden).

goatlover 5y ago

So we turn off power plants, stop manufacturing, and people all over the world stop driving, shipping, farming and flying with anything that emits C02. What do you suppose happens after that?

jellicle 5y ago
The US has been spending a couple hundred million dollars per day on the war in Afghanistan alone for the last 20 years. No one even noticed. If the US put its mind to it (WWII levels of mobilization), it could probably achieve full renewable electrical conversion (all fossil fuel infrastructure obsoleted and removed) within five years or so.
- aidenn0 5y ago
  There are 300 million people in the US, so "A couple hundred million dollars per day" is less than 1 dollar per person, per day. At $1 per person per day, it would take a lot of days to convert everyone to full renewable.