4 ms·

I say get them out of looking for speeders and light-runners, first off. That can be a whole other job. Boom, you now need... what, 1/3 as many cops? Even that

I say get them out of looking for speeders and light-runners, first off. That can be a whole other job. Boom, you now need... what, 1/3 as many cops? Even that many? Might even help at least a bit with the whole "driving while black" thing if the people tasked with this are just looking for traffic violations and aren't fishing for other things (unless you're dumb enough to offer them up, and they'll be recording, obviously)

reducesuffering 5y ago
> I say get them out of looking for speeders and light-runners, first off. That can be a whole other job. Massive surveillance or pull-overs: pick at least one. Pull-overs? That person better be prepared for shots fired in America.
- reilly3000 5y ago
  Interesting dichotomy. Red-light cameras are a sort of proto form of surveillance policing. It’s an interesting case study, where you have some celebrating the safety they purportedly provide, others accusing them of being a corrupt cash grab, and several states outright banning them. For many, driving is a form of negotiation between themselves, other drivers, pedestrians, and the roads. The cameras don’t play fair; they throw away all context (it was 4am with nobody around, it was icy and a sudden stop would have endangered somebody etc). They have ended marriages when cheaters are caught with the wrong person or in the wrong place. They subvert established norms. They work, but we don’t want them to. Are they better than paying a police officer to do that job? Better than no enforcement? The jury seems to be still out on this topic, but it could prove instructive to future automated enforcement initiatives.
  - jakelazaroff 5y ago
    > The cameras don’t play fair; they throw away all context (it was 4am with nobody around, it was icy and a sudden stop would have endangered somebody etc). How is this less fair? One of the biggest criticisms of the police apparatus is discretionary enforcement of the law. I bet Black motorists would overwhelmingly support a system blind to the "context" of the driver's skin color.
- jakelazaroff 5y ago
  The danger of traffic stops is severely overstated: https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/04/daunte-wright-dangerous-traffic-stop-myth.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/04/daunte-wright-da...

reducesuffering 5y ago

> I say get them out of looking for speeders and light-runners, first off. That can be a whole other job. Massive surveillance or pull-overs: pick at least one. Pull-overs? That person better be prepared for shots fired in America.

reilly3000 5y ago
Interesting dichotomy. Red-light cameras are a sort of proto form of surveillance policing. It’s an interesting case study, where you have some celebrating the safety they purportedly provide, others accusing them of being a corrupt cash grab, and several states outright banning them. For many, driving is a form of negotiation between themselves, other drivers, pedestrians, and the roads. The cameras don’t play fair; they throw away all context (it was 4am with nobody around, it was icy and a sudden stop would have endangered somebody etc). They have ended marriages when cheaters are caught with the wrong person or in the wrong place. They subvert established norms. They work, but we don’t want them to. Are they better than paying a police officer to do that job? Better than no enforcement? The jury seems to be still out on this topic, but it could prove instructive to future automated enforcement initiatives.
- jakelazaroff 5y ago
  > The cameras don’t play fair; they throw away all context (it was 4am with nobody around, it was icy and a sudden stop would have endangered somebody etc). How is this less fair? One of the biggest criticisms of the police apparatus is discretionary enforcement of the law. I bet Black motorists would overwhelmingly support a system blind to the "context" of the driver's skin color.
jakelazaroff 5y ago
The danger of traffic stops is severely overstated: https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/04/daunte-wright-dangerous-traffic-stop-myth.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/04/daunte-wright-da...