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>solve poverty, and/or socio-economic divides in housing distribution Most countries don't have education quality this much tied to local property taxes. It is

>solve poverty, and/or socio-economic divides in housing distribution Most countries don't have education quality this much tied to local property taxes. It is totally possible to increase equality for education without fully fix income/housing inequality.

mudil 5y ago
Just FYI, US public education is not good even in affluent areas.
- fuzzylightbulb 5y ago
  > Just FYI, US public education is not good even in effluent areas. See: Freudian slip
- Cookingboy 5y ago
  Compared to what? I grew up in Shanghai and went to great schools but I also attended one of the best public school districts in Texas for high school, and there are many areas that I think my high school did better than its Chinese counterparts.
- PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
  I grew up in the UK, and went to public schools there (comprehensives, no grammar schools etc). I've lived in Seattle, Philadelphia and now near Santa Fe. I've raised 3 children through public and a tiny bit of private schooling. The good US education which my children received in suburban Phila. was very, very good. It wasn't really the education I had dreamed of them having, and it certainly wasn't the education that I received. It was different from both, but still excellent. My two daughters enjoyed school a lot, which coming from the UK in the 1970s is quite a big deal all by itself. My son, less so, but even he (now 32) finds many good parts to look back on. The education paid less attention to the rote learning I experienced, and lots more attention to collaborative learning, integrated curricula (crossing subject domains, for example), and individual student empowerment. So yeah, my kinds don't know how a wheatstone bridge operates (I'm not even sure they know how an electrical switch operates). But I am absolutely confident that they are at least as well, if not better equipped for the world they are now adults in than they would have been if they had experienced the education I received in the UK. This is certainly not true across the US. But it was true in a very affluent, extremely well-funded school district, and that by itself, IMO, invalidates your claim.
- cafard 5y ago
  Oh? Co-workers' kids have got excellent educations in Montgomery County, Maryland, and Fairfax County, Virginia. Others have done quite well in the District of Columbia magnet high schools or at Wilson High School there.
handrous 5y ago
The property tax thing is mostly a red herring. Again, some of the best-funded schools in my city are the worst ones, because they get lots of money from other programs that aren't funded by local property taxes. They're still very bad. Insufficient spending may be a part of the problem in some areas but even if you entirely fixed that, you'd have done very little to fix American schooling.
- Karrot_Kream 5y ago
  This might be the case in your school, but where I grew up in the ghetto, the schools were absolutely falling apart. We didn't have the money to maintain vegetation so most of the school used sand. Our sports courts were forever falling apart (though luckily even bent basketball hoops work well enough to satisfy bored teens). Our library couldn't afford to stay open. Some of our classes were administered in trailers because the school didn't have enough classroom space. The power would go out from time to time because the school didn't have enough money to upgrade their power distribution infrastructure. There were never enough textbooks to go around and in certain classes you would share textbooks with a classmate. Lockers were never maintained and routinely vandalized when they seemed to be in good-repair. The water fountains had questionably potable water (I've had better water on hiking trails). We would frequently run out of soap in the bathrooms. And of course the quality of instruction was abysmal. I agree that local property taxes aren't the whole picture but they determine _quite a bit_. I know kids who grew up in more middle (or higher) class neighborhoods had higher property tax values and didn't suffer many of these problems as a result. As it is growing up in the hood was a pretty harrowing experience, but let me tell you that I did not look forward through trudging through sand into a trailer to take class by an unmotivated teacher who just wanted to clock out. Sure American education is still horribly patch-worky and quality is highly determined by local government policies, but there's a base level of dysfunction that can be solved through funding schools outside of property taxes.
- PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
  The NYT article is about schools with broken sewage pipes leaking into the floor, missing textbooks, missing teachers. You can talk all you like about the other factors that affect the quality of educational outcomes in a given school (district), but if basic infrastructure like those I've cited from TFA is not functioning, the other factors don't really make a lot of difference.

mudil 5y ago

Just FYI, US public education is not good even in affluent areas.

fuzzylightbulb 5y ago
> Just FYI, US public education is not good even in effluent areas. See: Freudian slip
Cookingboy 5y ago
Compared to what? I grew up in Shanghai and went to great schools but I also attended one of the best public school districts in Texas for high school, and there are many areas that I think my high school did better than its Chinese counterparts.
PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
I grew up in the UK, and went to public schools there (comprehensives, no grammar schools etc). I've lived in Seattle, Philadelphia and now near Santa Fe. I've raised 3 children through public and a tiny bit of private schooling. The good US education which my children received in suburban Phila. was very, very good. It wasn't really the education I had dreamed of them having, and it certainly wasn't the education that I received. It was different from both, but still excellent. My two daughters enjoyed school a lot, which coming from the UK in the 1970s is quite a big deal all by itself. My son, less so, but even he (now 32) finds many good parts to look back on. The education paid less attention to the rote learning I experienced, and lots more attention to collaborative learning, integrated curricula (crossing subject domains, for example), and individual student empowerment. So yeah, my kinds don't know how a wheatstone bridge operates (I'm not even sure they know how an electrical switch operates). But I am absolutely confident that they are at least as well, if not better equipped for the world they are now adults in than they would have been if they had experienced the education I received in the UK. This is certainly not true across the US. But it was true in a very affluent, extremely well-funded school district, and that by itself, IMO, invalidates your claim.
cafard 5y ago
Oh? Co-workers' kids have got excellent educations in Montgomery County, Maryland, and Fairfax County, Virginia. Others have done quite well in the District of Columbia magnet high schools or at Wilson High School there.

handrous 5y ago

The property tax thing is mostly a red herring. Again, some of the best-funded schools in my city are the worst ones, because they get lots of money from other programs that aren't funded by local property taxes. They're still very bad. Insufficient spending may be a part of the problem in some areas but even if you entirely fixed that, you'd have done very little to fix American schooling.

Karrot_Kream 5y ago
This might be the case in your school, but where I grew up in the ghetto, the schools were absolutely falling apart. We didn't have the money to maintain vegetation so most of the school used sand. Our sports courts were forever falling apart (though luckily even bent basketball hoops work well enough to satisfy bored teens). Our library couldn't afford to stay open. Some of our classes were administered in trailers because the school didn't have enough classroom space. The power would go out from time to time because the school didn't have enough money to upgrade their power distribution infrastructure. There were never enough textbooks to go around and in certain classes you would share textbooks with a classmate. Lockers were never maintained and routinely vandalized when they seemed to be in good-repair. The water fountains had questionably potable water (I've had better water on hiking trails). We would frequently run out of soap in the bathrooms. And of course the quality of instruction was abysmal. I agree that local property taxes aren't the whole picture but they determine _quite a bit_. I know kids who grew up in more middle (or higher) class neighborhoods had higher property tax values and didn't suffer many of these problems as a result. As it is growing up in the hood was a pretty harrowing experience, but let me tell you that I did not look forward through trudging through sand into a trailer to take class by an unmotivated teacher who just wanted to clock out. Sure American education is still horribly patch-worky and quality is highly determined by local government policies, but there's a base level of dysfunction that can be solved through funding schools outside of property taxes.
PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
The NYT article is about schools with broken sewage pipes leaking into the floor, missing textbooks, missing teachers. You can talk all you like about the other factors that affect the quality of educational outcomes in a given school (district), but if basic infrastructure like those I've cited from TFA is not functioning, the other factors don't really make a lot of difference.