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I find it amusing that Linus finds what I consider annoying behavior more usable. Changing things up is always painful. I really hate clicking on Terminal and h

by strmpnk 15y ago

I find it amusing that Linus finds what I consider annoying behavior more usable. Changing things up is always painful. I really hate clicking on Terminal and having something new pop up when I might just be trying to bring that application back into focus (to me 'one window' = 'one application' is a fallacy). EDIT: Seriously though. People are making a big deal out of someone having a different opinion. Silly.

flomo 15y ago
Gnome has been around, what, 10 years? If they are randomly changing behavior just because someone feeling it would be 'better', it indicates either nobody is using Gnome, or they don't care if anyone has been using Gnome. I don't see either Mac or Windows making these sorts of minor, workflow-breaking changes and just telling people to suck it up.
- thomas11 15y ago
  The changes are not "random", just because you don't know about the thoughts and testing that went into them. Mac made a huge all-breaking change with Mac OS X. That only occurs every few years, but as you say, Gnome 2 is ten years old. Then Lion introduced all kinds of workflow-breaking changes, like the automatic spelling correction, the "overview mode" or whatever it's called, the reversed scrolling. And you have to suck it up that much more on Mac OS, because there's just no way to install a different version of the interface.
  - ptomato 15y ago
    Two of those examples (spelling correction and reversed scrolling) are user configurable settings. Mission control I'd say is less of a workflow breaking change and more of the natural evolution of exposé & spaces.
- strmpnk 15y ago
  I agree. I do find it odd that they are changing things in one direction rather than making it optional or spinning off another project. Personally, I look forward to change even now, since computers are far from perfect.
alecbenzer 15y ago
I'm confused. > 'one window' = 'one application' is a fallacy > hate clicking on Terminal and having something new pop up when I might just be trying to bring that application back into focus Aren't those conflicting statements? The latter only occurs when the former is not considered a fallacy, no?
- lloeki 15y ago
  In a document-oriented switcher, the icon is the application, while the window is an open document (for a relaxed definition of 'document' when speaking about a terminal). So clicking on the application icon will present the user with all documents opened by this application, hence will raise all of its windows, while modifier+clicking will create a new document.
  - marrs 15y ago
    That sounds to me like an application oriented switcher. The application is focused, not the document. This has really annoying consequences in OS X where it trips me up all the time. For example, I open a pdf from within Safari. I finish reading and close it. I expect to be back in Safari: I'm not; I'm focused instead on a completely unrelated photograph that I'd opened ages ago and forgotten about. Linux GUIs were traditionally all about documents. As they've tried to converge with Mac and Windows, they've become more about apps. IMO that's a shame, but there it is.
- strmpnk 15y ago
  Like others have said, it's more about what the icon represents. A window (maybe a document) or an application. I prefer the application metaphor more than the window metaphor. I've come to like this since I don't always need to see all my windows to access a running application. That said, there is plenty of other questioning that can arise like, does one close the application when all windows are gone? Tricky.

by strmpnk 15y ago

flomo 15y ago

Gnome has been around, what, 10 years? If they are randomly changing behavior just because someone feeling it would be 'better', it indicates either nobody is using Gnome, or they don't care if anyone has been using Gnome. I don't see either Mac or Windows making these sorts of minor, workflow-breaking changes and just telling people to suck it up.

thomas11 15y ago
The changes are not "random", just because you don't know about the thoughts and testing that went into them. Mac made a huge all-breaking change with Mac OS X. That only occurs every few years, but as you say, Gnome 2 is ten years old. Then Lion introduced all kinds of workflow-breaking changes, like the automatic spelling correction, the "overview mode" or whatever it's called, the reversed scrolling. And you have to suck it up that much more on Mac OS, because there's just no way to install a different version of the interface.
- ptomato 15y ago
  Two of those examples (spelling correction and reversed scrolling) are user configurable settings. Mission control I'd say is less of a workflow breaking change and more of the natural evolution of exposé & spaces.
strmpnk 15y ago
I agree. I do find it odd that they are changing things in one direction rather than making it optional or spinning off another project. Personally, I look forward to change even now, since computers are far from perfect.

alecbenzer 15y ago

I'm confused. > 'one window' = 'one application' is a fallacy > hate clicking on Terminal and having something new pop up when I might just be trying to bring that application back into focus Aren't those conflicting statements? The latter only occurs when the former is not considered a fallacy, no?

lloeki 15y ago
In a document-oriented switcher, the icon is the application, while the window is an open document (for a relaxed definition of 'document' when speaking about a terminal). So clicking on the application icon will present the user with all documents opened by this application, hence will raise all of its windows, while modifier+clicking will create a new document.
- marrs 15y ago
  That sounds to me like an application oriented switcher. The application is focused, not the document. This has really annoying consequences in OS X where it trips me up all the time. For example, I open a pdf from within Safari. I finish reading and close it. I expect to be back in Safari: I'm not; I'm focused instead on a completely unrelated photograph that I'd opened ages ago and forgotten about. Linux GUIs were traditionally all about documents. As they've tried to converge with Mac and Windows, they've become more about apps. IMO that's a shame, but there it is.
strmpnk 15y ago
Like others have said, it's more about what the icon represents. A window (maybe a document) or an application. I prefer the application metaphor more than the window metaphor. I've come to like this since I don't always need to see all my windows to access a running application. That said, there is plenty of other questioning that can arise like, does one close the application when all windows are gone? Tricky.