4 ms·

Well there's definitely some people who think that, they say as much on their videos. One I watched claimed the only way to get rid of transphobia was for strai

Well there's definitely some people who think that, they say as much on their videos. One I watched claimed the only way to get rid of transphobia was for straight people to understand that you don't get to care about what kind of genitals your date has. You ll find out in bed.

simonklitj 5y ago
Interesting! Do I lose the ability to chose based on other things, then? Like, I prefer brunettes, would that be permitted, or should I be hair-color blind and just take what I’m given? I know you’re not an advocate for it, just interesting that some people hold this conviction!
- sascha_sl 5y ago
  This implies that trans people are deceptive. Is is deception if you prefer brunettes, but the person you're about to be intimate with has dyed their hair?
  - simonklitj 5y ago
    Hopefully it doesn’t! Would you like to point out how I imply that trans people are deceptive? Sure, but my preference for being solely with brunettes is not as strong as my preference for being solely with straight people, so the deception is not equal in its merited response. Perhaps this is bigoted, but I’m sincerely interested in your conviction.
    - sascha_sl 5y ago
      Well, trans is not really a hard factor for attraction. Fully cis-passing trans women exist, even in intimate relationships, and I'd wager not all things that go into that even matter to most people. Feel free to exclude based on physical criteria common in trans people, be it from masculine features, to larger frames to a set of genitals you're not attracted to, but "trans people" as category is way to broad. Because they can functionally be cis women. Unless you have a breeding fetish I guess. Insisting on a separate category feels like people are holding on to bioessentialist feeling that trans women must be men, which would make a cis man gay. Pair that with toxic masculinity and you have one of the reasons for violence particularly against trans women. (I have no personal stake at this, like many trans people I mostly date other trans people, less complicated and your partner has less of a hard time relating to you)
      - simonklitj 5y ago
        Hey, thanks for taking the time to explain so in depth. I definitely get what you’re saying, and I don’t know that I’ve thought about it like this before (to be fair, I’ve only ever been with my wife, so it isn’t a situation that would ever be relevant, and probably that’s why I haven’t). Best of luck!
sascha_sl 5y ago
I mean, you can decide if it ever goes that far, but trans people do not owe you disclosure about their genitals just like you do not owe your partners your entire medical history. It's probably still the right thing to do, purely because the trans panic defense is still a thing and it would be unsafe, but I see no moral obligation here.
- simonklitj 5y ago
  Do we not owe disclosure of certain things as part of our social contract? I would expect a partner to disclose certain things that are non-obvious, but potentially relevant to a relationship/hookup. But maybe I’m wrong, or painfully backwards. I would like to know, though, if you believe we owe no disclosure at all, prior to an engagement?
  - howinteresting 5y ago
    If you are not into trans women, the onus is on you to disclose that, not on the trans woman. This is because there is a long history of violence against trans women who disclose it, so as a cis man you need to do your part.
    - simonklitj 5y ago
      I think you might be right! I never thought of it like that.
- bob33212 5y ago
  If someone starts a conversation with you and then asks you on a date, you have no obligation to tell them anything. However if a person driving a Ferrari wearing a 5k suit and a 50k watch asks someone on a date, that person may be under the impression that they are going on a date with a rich person and that they will not be going to McDonald's. I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with taking your date to McDonald's. Plenty of people love McDonald's. But it is not the same thing and that date may not go well.
bob33212 5y ago
And that implies that gay people do not exist. A lesbian who says testicles are gross does not actually have a genetic sexual desire for biological women.

simonklitj 5y ago

Interesting! Do I lose the ability to chose based on other things, then? Like, I prefer brunettes, would that be permitted, or should I be hair-color blind and just take what I’m given? I know you’re not an advocate for it, just interesting that some people hold this conviction!

sascha_sl 5y ago
This implies that trans people are deceptive. Is is deception if you prefer brunettes, but the person you're about to be intimate with has dyed their hair?
- simonklitj 5y ago
  Hopefully it doesn’t! Would you like to point out how I imply that trans people are deceptive? Sure, but my preference for being solely with brunettes is not as strong as my preference for being solely with straight people, so the deception is not equal in its merited response. Perhaps this is bigoted, but I’m sincerely interested in your conviction.
  - sascha_sl 5y ago
    Well, trans is not really a hard factor for attraction. Fully cis-passing trans women exist, even in intimate relationships, and I'd wager not all things that go into that even matter to most people. Feel free to exclude based on physical criteria common in trans people, be it from masculine features, to larger frames to a set of genitals you're not attracted to, but "trans people" as category is way to broad. Because they can functionally be cis women. Unless you have a breeding fetish I guess. Insisting on a separate category feels like people are holding on to bioessentialist feeling that trans women must be men, which would make a cis man gay. Pair that with toxic masculinity and you have one of the reasons for violence particularly against trans women. (I have no personal stake at this, like many trans people I mostly date other trans people, less complicated and your partner has less of a hard time relating to you)
    - simonklitj 5y ago
      Hey, thanks for taking the time to explain so in depth. I definitely get what you’re saying, and I don’t know that I’ve thought about it like this before (to be fair, I’ve only ever been with my wife, so it isn’t a situation that would ever be relevant, and probably that’s why I haven’t). Best of luck!

sascha_sl 5y ago

I mean, you can decide if it ever goes that far, but trans people do not owe you disclosure about their genitals just like you do not owe your partners your entire medical history. It's probably still the right thing to do, purely because the trans panic defense is still a thing and it would be unsafe, but I see no moral obligation here.

simonklitj 5y ago
Do we not owe disclosure of certain things as part of our social contract? I would expect a partner to disclose certain things that are non-obvious, but potentially relevant to a relationship/hookup. But maybe I’m wrong, or painfully backwards. I would like to know, though, if you believe we owe no disclosure at all, prior to an engagement?
- howinteresting 5y ago
  If you are not into trans women, the onus is on you to disclose that, not on the trans woman. This is because there is a long history of violence against trans women who disclose it, so as a cis man you need to do your part.
  - simonklitj 5y ago
    I think you might be right! I never thought of it like that.
bob33212 5y ago
If someone starts a conversation with you and then asks you on a date, you have no obligation to tell them anything. However if a person driving a Ferrari wearing a 5k suit and a 50k watch asks someone on a date, that person may be under the impression that they are going on a date with a rich person and that they will not be going to McDonald's. I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with taking your date to McDonald's. Plenty of people love McDonald's. But it is not the same thing and that date may not go well.

bob33212 5y ago

And that implies that gay people do not exist. A lesbian who says testicles are gross does not actually have a genetic sexual desire for biological women.