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Why would young people take the vaccine if natural immunity protects better? Young people aren't at risk anyway. And the vaccine doesn't stop the spread of Delt

by vimy 5y ago

Why would young people take the vaccine if natural immunity protects better? Young people aren't at risk anyway. And the vaccine doesn't stop the spread of Delta. Yes, viral load is lower but lower viral load can still make someone very sick. So only older and vulnerable people should take it to protect themselves. >A growing body of evidence indicates that people fully vaccinated with an mRNA vaccine (Pfizer-BioNTech or Moderna) are less likely than unvaccinated persons to acquire SARS-CoV-2 or to transmit it to others. This is wrong. Correct would be "are less likely than unvaccinated persons without natural immunity to acquire SARS-CoV-2 or to transmit it to others" Even more baffling is how everyone seems to ignore we have a cure that works really well! https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavirus-covid-19-update-fda-authorizes-monoclonal-antibodies-treatment-covid-19 https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavi... The focus on the vaccine as the only solution is very weird.

bryan0 5y ago
> Why would young people take the vaccine if natural immunity protects better? 1. not everyone has natural immunity. 2. many people don't know whether they were actually infected with Covid or not. 3. It's not always better. (https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-pr...) 4. because if natural immunity gets you to x% protected there is no downside to taking a vaccine which gets you to (x+y)% protected. > Young people aren't at risk anyway. This is actually completely false. Young people are at less risk. Healthy young people are hospitalized and die of Covid just at a much lower rate. Not only that but they can spread it to older people that are at higher risk. > And the vaccine doesn't stop the spread of Delta Correct. It doesnt stop it (it's now endemic), but it lowers the transmission rate. > This is wrong. Correct would be "are less likely than unvaccinated persons without natural immunity to acquire SARS-CoV-2 or to transmit it to others" Nope. Whether naturally infected or not, vaccinated makes you less likely to get Covid. (https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-pr...) > Even more baffling is how everyone seems to ignore we have a cure that works really well! It's not a cure, monoclonal antibodies are a great treatment that is not ignored, but it's better not to get sick in the first place! from your article: "patients at high risk for disease progression, hospitalizations and emergency room visits occurred in 3% of casirivimab and imdevimab-treated patients on average compared to 9% in placebo-treated patients." That is not a cure. It is a good treatment to take if you need it.
- vimy 5y ago
  > This is actually completely false. Young people are at less risk. Healthy young people are hospitalized and die of Covid just at a much lower rate. Not only that but they can spread it to older people that are at higher risk. The risk is slightly higher than the flu so virtually non-existent. -> https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 And we have a treatment now to help those older people. > Nope. Whether naturally infected or not, vaccinated makes you less likely to get Covid. The Israel study tells us otherwise. > It's not a cure, monoclonal antibodies are a great treatment that is not ignored, but it's better not to get sick in the first place! It is ignored by the press and politicians. They keep telling us the only way out is vaccines. Which is wrong.
  - bryan0 5y ago
    > The Israel study tells us otherwise. you should re-read it. >The researchers also found that people who had SARS-CoV-2 previously and received one dose of the Pfizer-BioNTech messenger RNA (mRNA) vaccine were more highly protected against reinfection than those who once had the virus and were still unvaccinated. https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-on... > The risk is slightly higher than the flu so virtually non-existent. Flu kills hundreds of children a year. Tell one of their parents that the risk is "non-existent". That's why flu vaccine is recommended for most. > CDC recommends everyone 6 months and older get an annual flu vaccine, especially children who are younger than 5 years of age or children of any age who have a high risk medical condition, because they are more likely to develop serious flu complications that can lead to hospitalization and death. Getting vaccinated has been shown to reduce flu illnesses, doctor’s visits, missed school days, and reduce the risk of flu-related hospitalization and death in children. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/spotlights/2019-2020/2019-20-pediatric-flu-deaths.htm https://www.cdc.gov/flu/spotlights/2019-2020/2019-20-pediatr...
  - josephcsible 5y ago
    > The risk is slightly higher than the flu so virtually non-existent. -> https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 That sounds to me like the risk in young people is lower than the flu. The CDC also said the same: https://web.archive.org/web/20210820184423/https://www.cdc.gov/flu/symptoms/flu-vs-covid19.htm https://web.archive.org/web/20210820184423/https://www.cdc.g... > For young children, especially children younger than 5 years old, the risk of serious complications is higher for flu compared with COVID-19.
manwe150 5y ago
The vaccine does not prevent “natural immunity,” it enhances it. Hence why they can optimize by getting both. Treatment is good to have available, but has not been enough to bring the death rate down on-par with vaccination. It also does not contradict vaccination, but is best in tandem.
- vimy 5y ago
  I’m not against vaccination. It’s just weird how we’re doubling down on vaccines as the only solution. Delta changed the game, we should stop trying to pretend bullying everyone into taking the vaccine will solve the pandemic.
  - fanf2 5y ago
    Vaccines are not the only solution. Everyone should be wearing masks inside and in crowded places, and people responsible for buildings should be improving their ventilation.
  - bryan0 5y ago
    Seriously who believes vaccines are the “only” solution? They are one of the most important (if not the most important) tools we have against Covid. There is no magic bullet here, just reductions in probabilities.
    - manwe150 5y ago
      I would defend that claim, though agree that the ‘bullying’ is not helpful. Vaccines are the only solution so far that has been shown to substantially reduce individual risk, or show potential to solve the pandemic. Other measures are beneficial too, but I don’t believe any other solution has looked promising yet at getting to the end, only at dealing with the interim. Even herd immunity via infection is currently a worse (slower and more expensive) option. So every normal adult is personally benefited from vaccination. What’s weird about teaching people science?

by vimy 5y ago

bryan0 5y ago

> Why would young people take the vaccine if natural immunity protects better? 1. not everyone has natural immunity. 2. many people don't know whether they were actually infected with Covid or not. 3. It's not always better. (https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-pr...) 4. because if natural immunity gets you to x% protected there is no downside to taking a vaccine which gets you to (x+y)% protected. > Young people aren't at risk anyway. This is actually completely false. Young people are at less risk. Healthy young people are hospitalized and die of Covid just at a much lower rate. Not only that but they can spread it to older people that are at higher risk. > And the vaccine doesn't stop the spread of Delta Correct. It doesnt stop it (it's now endemic), but it lowers the transmission rate. > This is wrong. Correct would be "are less likely than unvaccinated persons without natural immunity to acquire SARS-CoV-2 or to transmit it to others" Nope. Whether naturally infected or not, vaccinated makes you less likely to get Covid. (https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-pr...) > Even more baffling is how everyone seems to ignore we have a cure that works really well! It's not a cure, monoclonal antibodies are a great treatment that is not ignored, but it's better not to get sick in the first place! from your article: "patients at high risk for disease progression, hospitalizations and emergency room visits occurred in 3% of casirivimab and imdevimab-treated patients on average compared to 9% in placebo-treated patients." That is not a cure. It is a good treatment to take if you need it.

vimy 5y ago
> This is actually completely false. Young people are at less risk. Healthy young people are hospitalized and die of Covid just at a much lower rate. Not only that but they can spread it to older people that are at higher risk. The risk is slightly higher than the flu so virtually non-existent. -> https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 And we have a treatment now to help those older people. > Nope. Whether naturally infected or not, vaccinated makes you less likely to get Covid. The Israel study tells us otherwise. > It's not a cure, monoclonal antibodies are a great treatment that is not ignored, but it's better not to get sick in the first place! It is ignored by the press and politicians. They keep telling us the only way out is vaccines. Which is wrong.
- bryan0 5y ago
  > The Israel study tells us otherwise. you should re-read it. >The researchers also found that people who had SARS-CoV-2 previously and received one dose of the Pfizer-BioNTech messenger RNA (mRNA) vaccine were more highly protected against reinfection than those who once had the virus and were still unvaccinated. https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-on... > The risk is slightly higher than the flu so virtually non-existent. Flu kills hundreds of children a year. Tell one of their parents that the risk is "non-existent". That's why flu vaccine is recommended for most. > CDC recommends everyone 6 months and older get an annual flu vaccine, especially children who are younger than 5 years of age or children of any age who have a high risk medical condition, because they are more likely to develop serious flu complications that can lead to hospitalization and death. Getting vaccinated has been shown to reduce flu illnesses, doctor’s visits, missed school days, and reduce the risk of flu-related hospitalization and death in children. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/spotlights/2019-2020/2019-20-pediatric-flu-deaths.htm https://www.cdc.gov/flu/spotlights/2019-2020/2019-20-pediatr...
- josephcsible 5y ago
  > The risk is slightly higher than the flu so virtually non-existent. -> https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 https://twitter.com/sentientist/status/1433575276009512961 That sounds to me like the risk in young people is lower than the flu. The CDC also said the same: https://web.archive.org/web/20210820184423/https://www.cdc.gov/flu/symptoms/flu-vs-covid19.htm https://web.archive.org/web/20210820184423/https://www.cdc.g... > For young children, especially children younger than 5 years old, the risk of serious complications is higher for flu compared with COVID-19.

manwe150 5y ago

The vaccine does not prevent “natural immunity,” it enhances it. Hence why they can optimize by getting both. Treatment is good to have available, but has not been enough to bring the death rate down on-par with vaccination. It also does not contradict vaccination, but is best in tandem.

vimy 5y ago
I’m not against vaccination. It’s just weird how we’re doubling down on vaccines as the only solution. Delta changed the game, we should stop trying to pretend bullying everyone into taking the vaccine will solve the pandemic.
- fanf2 5y ago
  Vaccines are not the only solution. Everyone should be wearing masks inside and in crowded places, and people responsible for buildings should be improving their ventilation.
- bryan0 5y ago
  Seriously who believes vaccines are the “only” solution? They are one of the most important (if not the most important) tools we have against Covid. There is no magic bullet here, just reductions in probabilities.
  - manwe150 5y ago
    I would defend that claim, though agree that the ‘bullying’ is not helpful. Vaccines are the only solution so far that has been shown to substantially reduce individual risk, or show potential to solve the pandemic. Other measures are beneficial too, but I don’t believe any other solution has looked promising yet at getting to the end, only at dealing with the interim. Even herd immunity via infection is currently a worse (slower and more expensive) option. So every normal adult is personally benefited from vaccination. What’s weird about teaching people science?