4 ms·

> invention of 4chan They set out to transform a symbol, and they succeeded. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OK_gesture#White_power_symbol https://en.wikipedia.o

> invention of 4chan They set out to transform a symbol, and they succeeded. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OK_gesture#White_power_symbol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OK_gesture#White_power_symbol If you think it isn't real because it was made up, Vonnegut's Mother Night has you covered: "We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be.”

rpmisms 5y ago
I think you're seeing a slightly different narrative. 4chan decided to make people upset about the hand sign, some major news networks obediently expressed outrage, and a whole lot of people who actively dislike said news channels discovered a whole new way to generate headlines.
- not2b 5y ago
  They were so successful at marketing the idea that the "ok" sign meant White Power that white nationalists started using it that way and the meaning shifted. And since a lot of the 4chan people are deeply racist they were basically saying "let's take over this symbol". And they succeeded.
  - kukx 5y ago
    As far as I know 4chan people were trolling the media and they succeeded. The result is both funny and scary. The scary part is that random people's lives are harmed because of some innocent photo or gesture. This insanity stems not only from media but also the new culture. Hopefully when going back to normality we will not swing too much to the other side.
    - Quanttek 5y ago
      You're completely ignoring the fact, started in the comment as well, that white nationalists have widely adopted the signal subsequently
chmod775 5y ago
They only succeeded if you let them. And if you do I'm going to think less of you for enabling them. Right now this new 'perception' is pretty limited to a certain US-centric news bubble. Everyone outside that bubble in the US, and generally people everywhere else, are likely to laugh in your face if you tried to convince them the OK gesture is a hate symbol now. Your average person hasn't even heard of this inane controversy. I for one have to seek out the kind of demographic who thinks that way online - because nowhere else could I even find anyone.
- MengerSponge 5y ago
  That same hand symbol has been super offensive in Germany for decades, but for scatological reasons, not white power ones. The swastika was a symbol of good luck, the infinity of creation and the unconquered, revolving sun for millennia. Now it's the symbol of the Nazi party and their atrocities. It's not fair, but that's how symbols work. Their meanings can change when new meanings are ascribed to them. https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2018/09/18/ok-sign-white-power-symbol-or-just-right-wing-troll https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2018/09/18/ok-sign-white... If a bunch of far-right dipshits want to rally around a cartoon frog and what used to be an innocuous hand gesture, then the meaning of those symbols is going to shift. You're the one playing into their hand. You're the one letting the cryptos remain crypto, instead of illuminating and naming their behavior, for shame.
- DoItToMe81 5y ago
  The same people blaring on about them somehow "taking over" a common symbol were, not so long ago, trying to claim that the same scumbags had somehow 'taken over milk' as a symbol of white supremacy. It's impossible to take these claims seriously. The media will publish anything that gets clicks, no matter how exaggerated or even fabricated, the people making up these claims know they'll get instant coverage and spread their 'cause', and the people spreading the idea that some loser somewhere saying "uh, the middle finger stands for the monolithic purity of the white race" is actually a threat to the fabric of society just enjoy having another thing to be morally panicked by.
paisawalla 5y ago
No. This gentleman is not, and was not, a white supremacist: https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/sdge-worker-fired-over-alleged-racist-gesture-says-he-was-cracking-knuckles/2347414 https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/sdge-worker-fired-ove... He didn't lose his job because of 4chan, but because of ostensibly well-intentioned midwits who believe "4chan succeeded in transforming a symbol" and "fake things can be real". Truly, this type of rationalization is the Bell Curve meme in action. He was fired because of the reaction -- engineered by 4chan -- of over-intellectualizing social justice nabobs who attend rallies and protests. You guys were literally told the punchline of the joke and still walked right into it.
- Jordrok 5y ago
  Maybe not, but this guy sure is: https://www.axios.com/christchuch-attacks-brenton-tarrant-1552716245-18d37895-d870-4e94-8dd6-0a56eb7a0a5e.html https://www.axios.com/christchuch-attacks-brenton-tarrant-15... Obviously the twitter hive-mind went too far in singling this one guy out, and SDG&E colossally fucked up in not doing basic due diligence before firing him. That doesn't change the fact though that there are people out there who do indeed use the hand sign to unironically mean exactly the things that 4chan set out to convince people that it meant. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending otherwise is nothing short of willful ignorance.
  - paisawalla 5y ago
    Amazing. The false information that this gesture means anything has everything to do with that man being fired, and contributes absolutely nothing to the awfulness of the Christchurch shooting, but you feel there is somehow an equivalence? Not only that, but you think there's moral superiority afforded to you for making this observation?
slim 5y ago
It's funny because that sign represents "allah" :) if I was into conspiracy I would say there's a 4chan elite directing hilarious ops inside 4chan
- rpmisms 5y ago
  4chan generally produces some of the most objectively hilarious scenarios. I recommend watching the "He will not divide us" series by Internet Historian on Youtube.
AnnoyedComment 5y ago
By this logic, you should start using racial slurs in a positive way.

rpmisms 5y ago

I think you're seeing a slightly different narrative. 4chan decided to make people upset about the hand sign, some major news networks obediently expressed outrage, and a whole lot of people who actively dislike said news channels discovered a whole new way to generate headlines.

not2b 5y ago
They were so successful at marketing the idea that the "ok" sign meant White Power that white nationalists started using it that way and the meaning shifted. And since a lot of the 4chan people are deeply racist they were basically saying "let's take over this symbol". And they succeeded.
- kukx 5y ago
  As far as I know 4chan people were trolling the media and they succeeded. The result is both funny and scary. The scary part is that random people's lives are harmed because of some innocent photo or gesture. This insanity stems not only from media but also the new culture. Hopefully when going back to normality we will not swing too much to the other side.
  - Quanttek 5y ago
    You're completely ignoring the fact, started in the comment as well, that white nationalists have widely adopted the signal subsequently

chmod775 5y ago

They only succeeded if you let them. And if you do I'm going to think less of you for enabling them. Right now this new 'perception' is pretty limited to a certain US-centric news bubble. Everyone outside that bubble in the US, and generally people everywhere else, are likely to laugh in your face if you tried to convince them the OK gesture is a hate symbol now. Your average person hasn't even heard of this inane controversy. I for one have to seek out the kind of demographic who thinks that way online - because nowhere else could I even find anyone.

MengerSponge 5y ago
That same hand symbol has been super offensive in Germany for decades, but for scatological reasons, not white power ones. The swastika was a symbol of good luck, the infinity of creation and the unconquered, revolving sun for millennia. Now it's the symbol of the Nazi party and their atrocities. It's not fair, but that's how symbols work. Their meanings can change when new meanings are ascribed to them. https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2018/09/18/ok-sign-white-power-symbol-or-just-right-wing-troll https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2018/09/18/ok-sign-white... If a bunch of far-right dipshits want to rally around a cartoon frog and what used to be an innocuous hand gesture, then the meaning of those symbols is going to shift. You're the one playing into their hand. You're the one letting the cryptos remain crypto, instead of illuminating and naming their behavior, for shame.
DoItToMe81 5y ago
The same people blaring on about them somehow "taking over" a common symbol were, not so long ago, trying to claim that the same scumbags had somehow 'taken over milk' as a symbol of white supremacy. It's impossible to take these claims seriously. The media will publish anything that gets clicks, no matter how exaggerated or even fabricated, the people making up these claims know they'll get instant coverage and spread their 'cause', and the people spreading the idea that some loser somewhere saying "uh, the middle finger stands for the monolithic purity of the white race" is actually a threat to the fabric of society just enjoy having another thing to be morally panicked by.

paisawalla 5y ago

No. This gentleman is not, and was not, a white supremacist: https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/sdge-worker-fired-over-alleged-racist-gesture-says-he-was-cracking-knuckles/2347414 https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/sdge-worker-fired-ove... He didn't lose his job because of 4chan, but because of ostensibly well-intentioned midwits who believe "4chan succeeded in transforming a symbol" and "fake things can be real". Truly, this type of rationalization is the Bell Curve meme in action. He was fired because of the reaction -- engineered by 4chan -- of over-intellectualizing social justice nabobs who attend rallies and protests. You guys were literally told the punchline of the joke and still walked right into it.

Jordrok 5y ago
Maybe not, but this guy sure is: https://www.axios.com/christchuch-attacks-brenton-tarrant-1552716245-18d37895-d870-4e94-8dd6-0a56eb7a0a5e.html https://www.axios.com/christchuch-attacks-brenton-tarrant-15... Obviously the twitter hive-mind went too far in singling this one guy out, and SDG&E colossally fucked up in not doing basic due diligence before firing him. That doesn't change the fact though that there are people out there who do indeed use the hand sign to unironically mean exactly the things that 4chan set out to convince people that it meant. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending otherwise is nothing short of willful ignorance.
- paisawalla 5y ago
  Amazing. The false information that this gesture means anything has everything to do with that man being fired, and contributes absolutely nothing to the awfulness of the Christchurch shooting, but you feel there is somehow an equivalence? Not only that, but you think there's moral superiority afforded to you for making this observation?

slim 5y ago

It's funny because that sign represents "allah" :) if I was into conspiracy I would say there's a 4chan elite directing hilarious ops inside 4chan

rpmisms 5y ago
4chan generally produces some of the most objectively hilarious scenarios. I recommend watching the "He will not divide us" series by Internet Historian on Youtube.

AnnoyedComment 5y ago

By this logic, you should start using racial slurs in a positive way.