6 ms·

On point 3: > I likely don't even know what "working" means in the context of your app. I think both sides can do more to reach into the domain of the other. I

• nucleardog 5y ago
  Not being able to say "That's not my job." just leads to dysfunctional organizations, burnout, and resourcing issues. Different job roles exist for a reason. In the case of developers and ops, developers develop, ops manages ... well, usually literally everything else, and there should be _some_ overlap in the middle. If you can't say "no, I can't do your job for you", then that area of shared responsibility just gets wider and wider and, if one side _is_ doing that (as developers usually won't step into the ops end too deep), it shifts further and further to one side. In the case of a typical organization where you have maybe an ops person per dozen or two dozen developers, that person very quickly becomes a bottleneck. That person gets burned out. You need to hire a bunch of expensive ops people to do work cheaper developers could be doing. Literally watched the lack of role definition and a bunch of ops people that, by virtue of almost everything being their job, won't say "not my job" do this at a company I'm leaving. A couple months back I was literally writing code in one of our apps because the team that owned the project "didn't know elasticsearch and didn't have time to figure it out".