4 ms·

.NET Gadgeteer (Open Source Arduino-like devices for .NET)

32 points by Jarred 15y ago

angusgr 15y ago
See also http://netduino.com/ http://netduino.com/ for a very similar project that's been around for a while, albeit not with Microsoft sponsoring it. At this point it seems pretty much another "me-too" Arduino[1]. The noteworthy fact, I guess, is that it's coming from a major software company not an embedded company this time, and that it's open source hardware/software from Microsoft (OSS libraries not tools/runtime.) Microsoft have been trundling along with .NET microframework/robotics studio/etc for quite a while now, is this a sign of an escalating push into the hobbyist/education/maker space? [1] As per http://antipastohw.blogspot.com/2010/12/end-of-open-source-hardware-cambrian.html http://antipastohw.blogspot.com/2010/12/end-of-open-source-h... Similar other examples include chipKIT Max32, TI Launchpad.
- Jarred 15y ago
  If this was the same price as Arduino, this would more than likely change Arduino's market dominance. Microsoft's development tools along with C# makes this much more exciting than most of what Arduino has to offer.
  - angusgr 15y ago
    Oh wow, I hadn't looked at the price. $119 for the FEZ spider mainboard, and $249 for the starter kit. Education market, I guess? The Netduino is $39 (admittedly, GHIs other smaller "non-gadgeteer" FEZ products compete with that), Netduino Plus (ethernet/SD) is $59, but the FEZ does have a ton more features than either. And I guess presumably we can expect more "gadgeteer clones" in the next year or so. As for Arduino's market dominance, it seems like suitability/competitiveness really depends on what you want to build. This stuff is several levels up in terms of abstraction and features. Some projects will embrace that, for some it'll just be window dressing. Regarding development tools, TI has a really convenient USB-driven live debugger for their MSP platform, AFAIK including the Launchpad boards. Arduino is still the market leader, despite an absolutely bare-bones (but dead simple) IDE. Maybe Visual Studio tools will tip the balance, I don't know. It'll be an interesting space to watch, that's for sure.
    - encoderer 15y ago
      It's not fair to compare just on price like that. Did you read the list of included components in the starter kit? I've thought about tinkering with an arduino, but I always wonder what on earth I'd do with it. I suppose I've seen some cool shields. But nothing that's made me WANT it. I can't say the same about that starter kit. I think the truth is that most software developers are paid well enough that $250 is not unreasonable, especially when put in context of how much money we all spend on 1) Hobbies and 2) Gadgets and 3) Developing our skillset.
      - angusgr 15y ago
        It's not fair to compare just on price like that. Did you read the list of included components in the starter kit? Well, as I also said "the FEZ does have a ton more features than either" and "This stuff is several levels up in terms of abstraction and features". But OTOH "suitability/competitiveness really depends on what you want to build." I've thought about tinkering with an arduino, but I always wonder what on earth I'd do with it. I can't say the same about that starter kit. If you don't mind me asking, what do you think you'd do with the FEZ starter kit? I don't mean that in an argumentative way, just properly trying to understand.
xpaulbettsx 15y ago
The unique thing about .NET Gadgeteer is how easy it is to connect and reconfigure different components, even complex ones like cameras. MSR uses it to prototype hardware devices and they wanted to release it externally: http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/news/features/gadgeteer-080111.aspx http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/news/features/gadgeteer-... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRX_rdlCkUQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRX_rdlCkUQ
sjs 15y ago
This is pretty cool. Turns out it runs the .NET microframework which is a Microsoft project to bring .NET to embedded devices. It brings embedded devices closer to a lot of people which seems good for everyone. I was skeptical about it being a real "open source platform" as they say but it really is. Not 100% open but boy is it good for MS. I wonder if they've opened up any more since then. http://blogs.msdn.com/b/netmfteam/archive/2009/11/15/net-micro-framework-version-4-0-ships-open-source-community-development-and-more.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/netmfteam/archive/2009/11/15/net-mic...
JL2010 15y ago
I have one of GHI's budget offerings in arduino form factor, the FEZ Panda II, and I really like it. In terms of quick prototyping and debugging I think the .NET Micro-framework is a hit. However, I don't see it being useful outside of the hobbyist/prototyping domain. The run-time environment would be considered too bloated for the purpose of simple embedded systems (by simple I mean without an OS/RTOS) and requires more expensive hardware to support it. However, I'm quite happy using C# and the .NET libraries! I'm putting together a wireless sensor network with a coordinator that doubles as an embedded web server to control various things via a web interface :D. Development time has definitely been reduced compared to writing everything in C.
hc5 15y ago
That "i" at the top of the page is really bothering me...
FrojoS 15y ago
Great. Kudus for Microsoft for ending the need for bitmanipulation. What I always wonder is, how do you commonly go ahead, once you build a successful prototype? Say you want to produce something like 10,000 devices. The Arduino or here the Gadgeteer, is a bit expensive for that. Do you have to start from scratch again, with something like a TI MSP?

32 points by Jarred 15y ago

See also http://netduino.com/ http://netduino.com/ for a very similar project that's been around for a while, albeit not with Microsoft sponsoring it. At this point it seems pretty much another "me-too" Arduino[1]. The noteworthy fact, I guess, is that it's coming from a major software company not an embedded company this time, and that it's open source hardware/software from Microsoft (OSS libraries not tools/runtime.) Microsoft have been trundling along with .NET microframework/robotics studio/etc for quite a while now, is this a sign of an escalating push into the hobbyist/education/maker space? [1] As per http://antipastohw.blogspot.com/2010/12/end-of-open-source-hardware-cambrian.html http://antipastohw.blogspot.com/2010/12/end-of-open-source-h... Similar other examples include chipKIT Max32, TI Launchpad.

Jarred 15y ago
If this was the same price as Arduino, this would more than likely change Arduino's market dominance. Microsoft's development tools along with C# makes this much more exciting than most of what Arduino has to offer.
- angusgr 15y ago
  Oh wow, I hadn't looked at the price. $119 for the FEZ spider mainboard, and $249 for the starter kit. Education market, I guess? The Netduino is $39 (admittedly, GHIs other smaller "non-gadgeteer" FEZ products compete with that), Netduino Plus (ethernet/SD) is $59, but the FEZ does have a ton more features than either. And I guess presumably we can expect more "gadgeteer clones" in the next year or so. As for Arduino's market dominance, it seems like suitability/competitiveness really depends on what you want to build. This stuff is several levels up in terms of abstraction and features. Some projects will embrace that, for some it'll just be window dressing. Regarding development tools, TI has a really convenient USB-driven live debugger for their MSP platform, AFAIK including the Launchpad boards. Arduino is still the market leader, despite an absolutely bare-bones (but dead simple) IDE. Maybe Visual Studio tools will tip the balance, I don't know. It'll be an interesting space to watch, that's for sure.
  - encoderer 15y ago
    It's not fair to compare just on price like that. Did you read the list of included components in the starter kit? I've thought about tinkering with an arduino, but I always wonder what on earth I'd do with it. I suppose I've seen some cool shields. But nothing that's made me WANT it. I can't say the same about that starter kit. I think the truth is that most software developers are paid well enough that $250 is not unreasonable, especially when put in context of how much money we all spend on 1) Hobbies and 2) Gadgets and 3) Developing our skillset.
    - angusgr 15y ago
      It's not fair to compare just on price like that. Did you read the list of included components in the starter kit? Well, as I also said "the FEZ does have a ton more features than either" and "This stuff is several levels up in terms of abstraction and features". But OTOH "suitability/competitiveness really depends on what you want to build." I've thought about tinkering with an arduino, but I always wonder what on earth I'd do with it. I can't say the same about that starter kit. If you don't mind me asking, what do you think you'd do with the FEZ starter kit? I don't mean that in an argumentative way, just properly trying to understand.

xpaulbettsx 15y ago

The unique thing about .NET Gadgeteer is how easy it is to connect and reconfigure different components, even complex ones like cameras. MSR uses it to prototype hardware devices and they wanted to release it externally: http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/news/features/gadgeteer-080111.aspx http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/news/features/gadgeteer-... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRX_rdlCkUQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRX_rdlCkUQ

sjs 15y ago

This is pretty cool. Turns out it runs the .NET microframework which is a Microsoft project to bring .NET to embedded devices. It brings embedded devices closer to a lot of people which seems good for everyone. I was skeptical about it being a real "open source platform" as they say but it really is. Not 100% open but boy is it good for MS. I wonder if they've opened up any more since then. http://blogs.msdn.com/b/netmfteam/archive/2009/11/15/net-micro-framework-version-4-0-ships-open-source-community-development-and-more.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/netmfteam/archive/2009/11/15/net-mic...

JL2010 15y ago

I have one of GHI's budget offerings in arduino form factor, the FEZ Panda II, and I really like it. In terms of quick prototyping and debugging I think the .NET Micro-framework is a hit. However, I don't see it being useful outside of the hobbyist/prototyping domain. The run-time environment would be considered too bloated for the purpose of simple embedded systems (by simple I mean without an OS/RTOS) and requires more expensive hardware to support it. However, I'm quite happy using C# and the .NET libraries! I'm putting together a wireless sensor network with a coordinator that doubles as an embedded web server to control various things via a web interface :D. Development time has definitely been reduced compared to writing everything in C.

hc5 15y ago

That "i" at the top of the page is really bothering me...

FrojoS 15y ago

Great. Kudus for Microsoft for ending the need for bitmanipulation. What I always wonder is, how do you commonly go ahead, once you build a successful prototype? Say you want to produce something like 10,000 devices. The Arduino or here the Gadgeteer, is a bit expensive for that. Do you have to start from scratch again, with something like a TI MSP?