5 ms·

> EPI will bring true value for both retail payments and payments between individuals “peer-to-peer” How does something that is highly traceable bring 'value'

by vmoore 5y ago

> EPI will bring true value for both retail payments and payments between individuals “peer-to-peer” How does something that is highly traceable bring 'value' and is preferred over plain cash?

krastanov 5y ago
There are plenty of situations where I would prefer this over cash if I trust the government to have my interests in mind (something true of some Europeans). Not carrying easily stolen cash, having it tracked so you can dispute things in court, just being more convenient the way NFC payments are. And the government gets to clamp down (or better, simply tax) on dark and grey markets. But then I also want to have a stash of cash "just in case" and be able to buy substances and tools that might be illegal... So YMMV. I guess, ideologically, I prefer to lobby the government to make something legal, not to ensure there are loopholes so that I can get away with illegal stuff I want to do. But I understand that is not always possible.
abricot 5y ago
In Denmark we have an app called mobilepay. Almost everyone trading peer to peer in e.x. Facebook marketplace and in local and in flea markets prefer using it over cash, especially when sending parcels, as you have something to go by if someone scams you. Also pretty much no one has cash any more.
- teekert 5y ago
  In the Netherlands we can send each other payment request via iDeal, they are also instant and involve sharing a link (over chat or whatever) you tap it and pay with your own banking app. Very handy, but sadly only in the Netherlands, consequently it is the only thing I miss from my banking app (N26) and iDeal requires me to keep a Dutch bank around.
- ksec 5y ago
  >in e.x. Facebook marketplace Um... Does it require 30%+ if it was on iOS?
  - abricot 5y ago
    I'm not sure what you're asking. Facebook Marketplace just list items, payment does not happen through it.
andai 5y ago
I'd say the main value over cash is that cash will stop existing soon. I tried to deposit cash at my bank in the Netherlands a few weeks ago and they refused to accept it, telling me I had to use a new inter-bank ATM system for deposits ("to make things easier for everybody"). I spent a week traveling to local towns trying to find an ATM that wasn't out of service, and which took deposits.
- Reason077 5y ago
  > ”I tried to deposit cash at my bank in the Netherlands a few weeks ago and they refused to accept it” I’m surprised that it’s legal for a bank to refuse a cash deposit.
  - andylynch 5y ago
    It's not that surprising - only a couple of the banks around where I work still have traditional counters, though the suburban braches do.
- bobthepanda 5y ago
  That sounds like a good reason to mandate that bank branches must accept cash.
- ksec 5y ago
  >I'd say the main value over cash is that cash will stop existing soon The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
ClumsyPilot 5y ago
"How does something that is highly traceable bring 'value'" Everyone claims they want untraceable money untill they get screwed over by a merchant or employer, then having traceability makes it much easier to go after the crooks. I, for one, would rather not use anonymous untraceable crypto if i am about to pay for a house
- dtech 5y ago
  In my country - and most I suspect - you have to make your house payment to a notary, about as far away from anonymous untraceable as you can get. I think that's good.
- lottin 5y ago
  Exactly. Untraceable money is incompatible with proof of payment, which means it's unusable for commercial transactions.

by vmoore 5y ago

> EPI will bring true value for both retail payments and payments between individuals “peer-to-peer” How does something that is highly traceable bring 'value' and is preferred over plain cash?

krastanov 5y ago

There are plenty of situations where I would prefer this over cash if I trust the government to have my interests in mind (something true of some Europeans). Not carrying easily stolen cash, having it tracked so you can dispute things in court, just being more convenient the way NFC payments are. And the government gets to clamp down (or better, simply tax) on dark and grey markets. But then I also want to have a stash of cash "just in case" and be able to buy substances and tools that might be illegal... So YMMV. I guess, ideologically, I prefer to lobby the government to make something legal, not to ensure there are loopholes so that I can get away with illegal stuff I want to do. But I understand that is not always possible.

abricot 5y ago

In Denmark we have an app called mobilepay. Almost everyone trading peer to peer in e.x. Facebook marketplace and in local and in flea markets prefer using it over cash, especially when sending parcels, as you have something to go by if someone scams you. Also pretty much no one has cash any more.

teekert 5y ago
In the Netherlands we can send each other payment request via iDeal, they are also instant and involve sharing a link (over chat or whatever) you tap it and pay with your own banking app. Very handy, but sadly only in the Netherlands, consequently it is the only thing I miss from my banking app (N26) and iDeal requires me to keep a Dutch bank around.
ksec 5y ago
>in e.x. Facebook marketplace Um... Does it require 30%+ if it was on iOS?
- abricot 5y ago
  I'm not sure what you're asking. Facebook Marketplace just list items, payment does not happen through it.

andai 5y ago

I'd say the main value over cash is that cash will stop existing soon. I tried to deposit cash at my bank in the Netherlands a few weeks ago and they refused to accept it, telling me I had to use a new inter-bank ATM system for deposits ("to make things easier for everybody"). I spent a week traveling to local towns trying to find an ATM that wasn't out of service, and which took deposits.

Reason077 5y ago
> ”I tried to deposit cash at my bank in the Netherlands a few weeks ago and they refused to accept it” I’m surprised that it’s legal for a bank to refuse a cash deposit.
- andylynch 5y ago
  It's not that surprising - only a couple of the banks around where I work still have traditional counters, though the suburban braches do.
bobthepanda 5y ago
That sounds like a good reason to mandate that bank branches must accept cash.
ksec 5y ago
>I'd say the main value over cash is that cash will stop existing soon The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

ClumsyPilot 5y ago

"How does something that is highly traceable bring 'value'" Everyone claims they want untraceable money untill they get screwed over by a merchant or employer, then having traceability makes it much easier to go after the crooks. I, for one, would rather not use anonymous untraceable crypto if i am about to pay for a house

dtech 5y ago
In my country - and most I suspect - you have to make your house payment to a notary, about as far away from anonymous untraceable as you can get. I think that's good.
lottin 5y ago
Exactly. Untraceable money is incompatible with proof of payment, which means it's unusable for commercial transactions.