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I was thinking the same. The Y is a great EV, it is also a $53K+ vehicle. There's a LOT of people who would happily be driving an EV right now but their last g

I was thinking the same. The Y is a great EV, it is also a $53K+ vehicle. There's a LOT of people who would happily be driving an EV right now but their last gas guzzler wast less than half that cost. How can Norwegians swing their local equivalent of $53K for any vehicle EV or not? There has to be more going on here economically/financially.

brianwawok 5y ago
They actually make car buyers chip in to pay for the negative externalities of burning dinosaur bones. Here in Indiana I pay an EV tax to make up for lost gas tax revenue, literally the opposite of what should happen.
- sremani 5y ago
  EVs are heavier than normal cars and you are using the road. So, it is fair to pay the road tax. Assuming the money collected for this directly goes to road maintenance. I do not have problem with paying taxes that go for roads. Even though in my case I own PHEVs than BEVs. That would be last of my complains.
  - nicoburns 5y ago
    The effects of climate change are expected to be a lot more expensive than road maintenance, so I think the tax is still the wrong way around.
    - sremani 5y ago
      I would have agreed if EVs had no Carbon footprint.
  - brianwawok 5y ago
    Heavier part is not significant. The weight effect on road wear is like a 4th order effect. 1 semi-truck causes something like 100,000 the road wear of a single heavy EV. I am fine if we want to tax this route, but disel is now going to cost $300 a gallon for trucks.
- TheSmiddy 5y ago
  If road use taxes on EV's like Indiana's were legitimate then they would be applying them equally to all vehicles and either lowering the fuel excise in response or keeping it there as a carbon tax but since they apply only to EV's they are almost certainly the result of legislators bowing to their fossil fuel lobby donors.
chrisseaton 5y ago
> How can Norwegians swing their local equivalent of $53K for any vehicle EV or not? Norway is a very rich country - I don't think $53k is a barrier to most people there.
- lastofthemojito 5y ago
  Norway is a very rich country, but I'd also point out that despite their wealth they have substantially fewer cars per capita (~0.5) than the US (~0.8). Less wealthy European countries like Portugal and Lithuania have about as many cars per capita as Norway, likely due to the relatively high prices of cars and fuel in Norway. Basically, if ICE cars and gasoline weren't heavily taxed in Norway, and Norwegians could cheaply drive around in Subaru Outbacks and Toyota Corollas, a lot more of them probably would. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_...
  - hocuspocus 5y ago
    You're right but I think it's a little bit more complex than that. Switzerland is equally wealthy (or even more, if you look at disposable income) and here you can definitely buy a $3000 Subaru Outback and drive around in the Alps every weekend, yet car ownership is similar to Norway's, because it's a hassle when the train and public transportation network is good and convenient. Maybe without all these taxes, car ownership in Norway would be a bit higher (like in Finland) but I don't think it would reach the US number. Lots of the Norwegian population is concentrated in urbanized areas, and some have gone car-free. Even though there are few incentives in Switzerland, we see plenty of Teslas, because of course for some people $60k in a car is nothing. But that's definitely above average, and not everyone is able or willing to spend that much.
  - GordonS 5y ago
    Public transport in Norway is so good that there is less need for car ownership.
tyfon 5y ago
The average salary is close to the equivalent of $55000 and median is a bit over $50000, that helps. The fossils are also taxed heavily, the Audi Q7 for instance starts at over 1.1 million NOK, the Model Y starts at 550k or so. In comparison I bought my previous car (Toyota Avensis with 150 hp engine) in 2011 for 400k NOK. Then you have the fuel costs which is at around 16-18 NOK/liter, which comes out to about $7-8/us gallon and electricity is about 1 NOK/kWh. For an efficient fossil (5 liter/100km) it costs 1.5 NOK/km in fuel costs, the same for an EV is 0.25 NOK/km when charging at home depending on the efficiency. My ioniq costs even less. I drive a Model X (with a refresh X on order) and a classic ioniq electric myself, buying a new fossil here is just dumb at this point.
- GordonS 5y ago
  I'd also add that public transport in Norway is excellent.
dagw 5y ago
Cars in Norway have always been very expensive, so for Norwegians $40-50k is just what a new entry level car costs. Compared what else you can buy for $50k, the Model Y is bit of a bargain. An 'equivalent' gasoline powered Audi/BMW etc. would cost in excess of $100k.

brianwawok 5y ago

They actually make car buyers chip in to pay for the negative externalities of burning dinosaur bones. Here in Indiana I pay an EV tax to make up for lost gas tax revenue, literally the opposite of what should happen.

sremani 5y ago
EVs are heavier than normal cars and you are using the road. So, it is fair to pay the road tax. Assuming the money collected for this directly goes to road maintenance. I do not have problem with paying taxes that go for roads. Even though in my case I own PHEVs than BEVs. That would be last of my complains.
- nicoburns 5y ago
  The effects of climate change are expected to be a lot more expensive than road maintenance, so I think the tax is still the wrong way around.
  - sremani 5y ago
    I would have agreed if EVs had no Carbon footprint.
- brianwawok 5y ago
  Heavier part is not significant. The weight effect on road wear is like a 4th order effect. 1 semi-truck causes something like 100,000 the road wear of a single heavy EV. I am fine if we want to tax this route, but disel is now going to cost $300 a gallon for trucks.
TheSmiddy 5y ago
If road use taxes on EV's like Indiana's were legitimate then they would be applying them equally to all vehicles and either lowering the fuel excise in response or keeping it there as a carbon tax but since they apply only to EV's they are almost certainly the result of legislators bowing to their fossil fuel lobby donors.

chrisseaton 5y ago

> How can Norwegians swing their local equivalent of $53K for any vehicle EV or not? Norway is a very rich country - I don't think $53k is a barrier to most people there.

lastofthemojito 5y ago
Norway is a very rich country, but I'd also point out that despite their wealth they have substantially fewer cars per capita (~0.5) than the US (~0.8). Less wealthy European countries like Portugal and Lithuania have about as many cars per capita as Norway, likely due to the relatively high prices of cars and fuel in Norway. Basically, if ICE cars and gasoline weren't heavily taxed in Norway, and Norwegians could cheaply drive around in Subaru Outbacks and Toyota Corollas, a lot more of them probably would. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_...
- hocuspocus 5y ago
  You're right but I think it's a little bit more complex than that. Switzerland is equally wealthy (or even more, if you look at disposable income) and here you can definitely buy a $3000 Subaru Outback and drive around in the Alps every weekend, yet car ownership is similar to Norway's, because it's a hassle when the train and public transportation network is good and convenient. Maybe without all these taxes, car ownership in Norway would be a bit higher (like in Finland) but I don't think it would reach the US number. Lots of the Norwegian population is concentrated in urbanized areas, and some have gone car-free. Even though there are few incentives in Switzerland, we see plenty of Teslas, because of course for some people $60k in a car is nothing. But that's definitely above average, and not everyone is able or willing to spend that much.
- GordonS 5y ago
  Public transport in Norway is so good that there is less need for car ownership.

tyfon 5y ago

The average salary is close to the equivalent of $55000 and median is a bit over $50000, that helps. The fossils are also taxed heavily, the Audi Q7 for instance starts at over 1.1 million NOK, the Model Y starts at 550k or so. In comparison I bought my previous car (Toyota Avensis with 150 hp engine) in 2011 for 400k NOK. Then you have the fuel costs which is at around 16-18 NOK/liter, which comes out to about $7-8/us gallon and electricity is about 1 NOK/kWh. For an efficient fossil (5 liter/100km) it costs 1.5 NOK/km in fuel costs, the same for an EV is 0.25 NOK/km when charging at home depending on the efficiency. My ioniq costs even less. I drive a Model X (with a refresh X on order) and a classic ioniq electric myself, buying a new fossil here is just dumb at this point.

GordonS 5y ago
I'd also add that public transport in Norway is excellent.

dagw 5y ago

Cars in Norway have always been very expensive, so for Norwegians $40-50k is just what a new entry level car costs. Compared what else you can buy for $50k, the Model Y is bit of a bargain. An 'equivalent' gasoline powered Audi/BMW etc. would cost in excess of $100k.