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> But more than 36% of foreign students in Finland leave within a year of graduation, according to government figures, with most citing immigration bureaucracy,

> But more than 36% of foreign students in Finland leave within a year of graduation, according to government figures, with most citing immigration bureaucracy, high taxation and language difficulties as their main reasons for quitting. Seems like a token gesture then, especially considering: > Many companies require Finnish and public sector employees must master both. So "declaring the city English-speaking" is pointless unless the city actually implements English as an official language, providing legal and civic support for English on all official matters. Seems like streamlining bureaucracy and reviewing the tax code would do more good, but of course it's much more involved than adjusting branding. (I am utterly uninformed in all matters Finland, for all I know Helsinki could already have such support and I do not know it, in that case, good for them and this is effectively a good move!)

Gravityloss 5y ago
None of the software companies require Finnish. I don't think many come here and get the education with the aim to become social workers. It's massively easier to get by with english here than almost anywhere else in Europe (besides UK and Ireland).
- bsmith 5y ago
  Almost all software consulting companies require Finnish, though, as most contracts these consulting firms have with their clients are that the developers are fluent in Finnish.
  - Gravityloss 5y ago
    Finland is a relatively small market. Sure, some consultancies make (or customize and integrate) software for local old fashioned companies like banks or for the government. But if you want to build a product and be ambitious and grow, exporting and going international is the only way. The local market just isn't that big. It looks very different compared to a larger country. I bet in Germany, you can make a lot of money with software just for German schools or banks or municipalities. Same in the UK.
    - Hamuko 5y ago
      You can still grow outside your local market with just local developers.
      - Gravityloss 5y ago
        The grandparent's point was that the engineer needs to communicate with the customer in Finnish. In reality, international companies have decoupled sales and development. Sales will be in customer countries. Sales will communicate with customer in customer's mother tongue. Sales will communicate with development in English. Software development will be done in English, with a diverse group of people, whether centralized or distributed.
sam_dal 5y ago
Travelled and stayed in Helsinki lots of times when at Nokia. Don't think language would be a major issue for a postgrad, wages and taxes more likely, specially in competitive / emerging fields. On the other hand the place is very attractive if you have family compared to any parts of the world.

Gravityloss 5y ago

None of the software companies require Finnish. I don't think many come here and get the education with the aim to become social workers. It's massively easier to get by with english here than almost anywhere else in Europe (besides UK and Ireland).

bsmith 5y ago
Almost all software consulting companies require Finnish, though, as most contracts these consulting firms have with their clients are that the developers are fluent in Finnish.
- Gravityloss 5y ago
  Finland is a relatively small market. Sure, some consultancies make (or customize and integrate) software for local old fashioned companies like banks or for the government. But if you want to build a product and be ambitious and grow, exporting and going international is the only way. The local market just isn't that big. It looks very different compared to a larger country. I bet in Germany, you can make a lot of money with software just for German schools or banks or municipalities. Same in the UK.
  - Hamuko 5y ago
    You can still grow outside your local market with just local developers.
    - Gravityloss 5y ago
      The grandparent's point was that the engineer needs to communicate with the customer in Finnish. In reality, international companies have decoupled sales and development. Sales will be in customer countries. Sales will communicate with customer in customer's mother tongue. Sales will communicate with development in English. Software development will be done in English, with a diverse group of people, whether centralized or distributed.

sam_dal 5y ago

Travelled and stayed in Helsinki lots of times when at Nokia. Don't think language would be a major issue for a postgrad, wages and taxes more likely, specially in competitive / emerging fields. On the other hand the place is very attractive if you have family compared to any parts of the world.