4 ms·

Windrush is not besides the point, because the UK government tried to repeat the same exercise with EU citizens. They even went as far as sending deportation le

by mmarq 5y ago

Windrush is not besides the point, because the UK government tried to repeat the same exercise with EU citizens. They even went as far as sending deportation letters to hundreds of random EU citizens, including doctors, university researchers, journalists and professionals (ie people with enough influence to get the attention of the press and with enough money to pay for a lawyer https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/23/home-office-apologises-for-letters-threatening-to-deport-eu-nationals https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/23/home-office...). I applied for the permanent resident status before the EU forced the UK to introduce the Settlement Scheme and I ended up sending kilograms of documentation to prove that I had lived in the UK for the previous 5 years. I could easily collect these documents because I only worked in FTSE companies, but my partner couldn’t because she worked for smaller firms that ceased activity and couldn’t provide reference letters. The process was clearly designed to prevent people from getting ILR, even if they had a right to it.

mytailorisrich 5y ago
You're trying to make a mountain out of a mole-hill, and again I don't understand why. An error to a few people (100 out of millions) and that resulted in nothing at all is not evidence of nefarious policy. Sending payslips and council tax bills is hardly a problem for anyone who's been living and working in the UK, and that was a standard EU-wide procedure. It was not designed to be difficult or make people fail, it only required evidence that the applicant had been exercising "treaty rights", which is quit reasonable. I was not in favour of Brexit but there is no reason to invent problems where there are none.
- gambiting 5y ago
  >>and that resulted in nothing at all is not evidence of nefarious policy. First of all, it doesn't result in nothing. I'm an EU citizen living in the UK and even though I haven't received a letter these sort of things make me deeply uncomfortable, to a point where this might be contributing to anxiety. So no, it's not nothing, these actions have consequences. And what do you mean it's not evidence of nefarious policy??? The policy is nefarous explicitly, by design, and publicly as well! The famour "hostile environment" established by Theresa May is exactly this - hostile. It's meant to make you feel unwelcome as an immigrant. >>there is no reason to invent problems where there are none. I really really wish I could have such a positive outlook on life where I could honestly go on an internet forum and say "invent problems where there are none" when it comes to EU citizens living in the UK. I'm jealous frankly.
- mmarq 5y ago
  No, it’s not a standard procedure in any EU country I’m aware of. I’ve never heard of anybody outside of the UK sending payslips and doctor notes and reference letters and mobile phone bills to prove their residence status. If hundreds of thousands of people weren’t at risk of deportation, the Settlement Scheme would not have been necessary.
  - mytailorisrich 5y ago
    It is standard procedure in order to get formal proof of permanent residence. The thing is that no-one bothers with it because it is usually not needed. The procedure existed before the referendum, it did not change because of the result. What changed is that people suddenly thought that it may be useful and decided to apply. For instance, just to stay in English, if you're in Ireland this is the form: http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Form-EUTR2.pdf/Files/Form-EUTR2.pdf http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Form-EUTR2.pdf/Files/Form-EUT... It's pretty much the exact same as the British one used to be, and as I already mentioned this is because it is based on an EU procedure, and so will be pretty much the same everywhere: https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/residence/documents-formalities/eu-nationals-permanent-residence/index_en.htm https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/residence/documents-fo... Note that some EU countries also require EU/EEA nationals to register with the police/local authorities, which the UK did not and so actually made life for EU citizens simpler that quite a few other EU countries. Another reality check here, apparently.
    - mmarq 5y ago
      > Note that some EU countries also require EU/EEA nationals to register with the police/local authorities, which the UK did not and so actually made life for EU citizens simpler that quite a few other EU countries. Also in the UK you have to register with the local authorities (read the local council), but then the government pretends you didn’t and asks for doctor notes and TV license bills.
      - mytailorisrich 5y ago
        You certainly don't have to in the UK. In fact you cannot because that does not exist... I'm obviously talking about registration for foreigners as indicated in link I posted, not registering for council tax or on election roll, which are obviously completely different and apply to everyone. Also, I don't see why you would need doctor notes or TV license bills... I don't think you are being in good faith here and this is getting very tedious.

by mmarq 5y ago

mytailorisrich 5y ago

You're trying to make a mountain out of a mole-hill, and again I don't understand why. An error to a few people (100 out of millions) and that resulted in nothing at all is not evidence of nefarious policy. Sending payslips and council tax bills is hardly a problem for anyone who's been living and working in the UK, and that was a standard EU-wide procedure. It was not designed to be difficult or make people fail, it only required evidence that the applicant had been exercising "treaty rights", which is quit reasonable. I was not in favour of Brexit but there is no reason to invent problems where there are none.

gambiting 5y ago
>>and that resulted in nothing at all is not evidence of nefarious policy. First of all, it doesn't result in nothing. I'm an EU citizen living in the UK and even though I haven't received a letter these sort of things make me deeply uncomfortable, to a point where this might be contributing to anxiety. So no, it's not nothing, these actions have consequences. And what do you mean it's not evidence of nefarious policy??? The policy is nefarous explicitly, by design, and publicly as well! The famour "hostile environment" established by Theresa May is exactly this - hostile. It's meant to make you feel unwelcome as an immigrant. >>there is no reason to invent problems where there are none. I really really wish I could have such a positive outlook on life where I could honestly go on an internet forum and say "invent problems where there are none" when it comes to EU citizens living in the UK. I'm jealous frankly.
mmarq 5y ago
No, it’s not a standard procedure in any EU country I’m aware of. I’ve never heard of anybody outside of the UK sending payslips and doctor notes and reference letters and mobile phone bills to prove their residence status. If hundreds of thousands of people weren’t at risk of deportation, the Settlement Scheme would not have been necessary.
- mytailorisrich 5y ago
  It is standard procedure in order to get formal proof of permanent residence. The thing is that no-one bothers with it because it is usually not needed. The procedure existed before the referendum, it did not change because of the result. What changed is that people suddenly thought that it may be useful and decided to apply. For instance, just to stay in English, if you're in Ireland this is the form: http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Form-EUTR2.pdf/Files/Form-EUTR2.pdf http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Form-EUTR2.pdf/Files/Form-EUT... It's pretty much the exact same as the British one used to be, and as I already mentioned this is because it is based on an EU procedure, and so will be pretty much the same everywhere: https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/residence/documents-formalities/eu-nationals-permanent-residence/index_en.htm https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/residence/documents-fo... Note that some EU countries also require EU/EEA nationals to register with the police/local authorities, which the UK did not and so actually made life for EU citizens simpler that quite a few other EU countries. Another reality check here, apparently.
  - mmarq 5y ago
    > Note that some EU countries also require EU/EEA nationals to register with the police/local authorities, which the UK did not and so actually made life for EU citizens simpler that quite a few other EU countries. Also in the UK you have to register with the local authorities (read the local council), but then the government pretends you didn’t and asks for doctor notes and TV license bills.
    - mytailorisrich 5y ago
      You certainly don't have to in the UK. In fact you cannot because that does not exist... I'm obviously talking about registration for foreigners as indicated in link I posted, not registering for council tax or on election roll, which are obviously completely different and apply to everyone. Also, I don't see why you would need doctor notes or TV license bills... I don't think you are being in good faith here and this is getting very tedious.