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> are not even compromising on truck driver immigration now Are you saying they should? I am from and in NL, and with all furthering EU integration there was t

> are not even compromising on truck driver immigration now Are you saying they should? I am from and in NL, and with all furthering EU integration there was the 'promise' from politicians it would be for the better for anyone. People who doubted this, for example truck drivers, were discounted as 'plebs' and not sophisticated enough. Guess what happened when free movement of labor was granted to the Eastern block? Citizens from these countries quickly replaced the local drivers to the point Dutch transport agencies engineered mechanisms which guaranteed to could keep selecting foreign labor. For the plebs this was of course no surprise. The ruling class just postulates 'everybody should become a knowledge worker'. I am highly educated but keep close tabs with all classes in my community. The EU is mostly a trade bloc, a market for labor, where commodization (of labor) thrives. Primarily beneficial for companies and government (workers). It is my opinion we should build strong local economies with opportunities for all. My only motivation for writing this is to present a differing viewpoint on the truck driver story.

the_mitsuhiko 5y ago
I mean you're basically describing why protectionism exists. Of course cheaper labor will displace more expensive labor, but that is quite literally why these jobs exist. Pay alone is not the reason the UK has a driver shortage, it's also the entire lifestyle that comes with it. The EU works on the idea that you can work anywhere (with some restrictions) not too different from how this works in different US states. Over a sufficiently long period of time the differences in pay in the EU will move closer. Not entirely, but quite a bit. And that is the long game that will solve these problems more than to restrict labor markets.
- the-dude 5y ago
  Protectionism vs open markets, nothing needs to be black and white. You are just re-iterating the tiresome mantra of the EU beneficiaries 'in the end it will all work out for you too'. Except, maybe not in your lifetime. It is a fundamental neo liberal viewpoint, and I admit in my opinion Labor (parties) have abandonded their constituency since the mid-80s. And I think that needs to change, and if it takes a bit of protectionism, so what.
  - the_mitsuhiko 5y ago
    If you think that in our lifetimes we won't see an increase of quality of live in eastern Europe then I have some bad news for your about your expectations to see benefits from protectionism. Brexit did not make people in the UK happier, quite the opposite. I don't see a future where this will change.
    - the-dude 5y ago
      > Brexit did not make people in the UK happier, quite the opposite. Do you have sources for this?

the_mitsuhiko 5y ago

I mean you're basically describing why protectionism exists. Of course cheaper labor will displace more expensive labor, but that is quite literally why these jobs exist. Pay alone is not the reason the UK has a driver shortage, it's also the entire lifestyle that comes with it. The EU works on the idea that you can work anywhere (with some restrictions) not too different from how this works in different US states. Over a sufficiently long period of time the differences in pay in the EU will move closer. Not entirely, but quite a bit. And that is the long game that will solve these problems more than to restrict labor markets.

the-dude 5y ago
Protectionism vs open markets, nothing needs to be black and white. You are just re-iterating the tiresome mantra of the EU beneficiaries 'in the end it will all work out for you too'. Except, maybe not in your lifetime. It is a fundamental neo liberal viewpoint, and I admit in my opinion Labor (parties) have abandonded their constituency since the mid-80s. And I think that needs to change, and if it takes a bit of protectionism, so what.
- the_mitsuhiko 5y ago
  If you think that in our lifetimes we won't see an increase of quality of live in eastern Europe then I have some bad news for your about your expectations to see benefits from protectionism. Brexit did not make people in the UK happier, quite the opposite. I don't see a future where this will change.
  - the-dude 5y ago
    > Brexit did not make people in the UK happier, quite the opposite. Do you have sources for this?