8 ms·

As I get older, the less I identify as my current state and the more I identify with the person who transitions through states. My change in perspective has red

by zwkrt 5y ago

As I get older, the less I identify as my current state and the more I identify with the person who transitions through states. My change in perspective has reduced my anxieties and anger significantly. "This too shall pass" and all that. The more of my self image is focused on superficial things, the more I will take things personally. What we are angry about tends to be a reflection of ourselves more than the current state of affairs. If I see myself as a busy professional I might be much more aggravated by someone at the grocery store holding up the checkout line with EBT (since I am busy they must be lazy!). If I see myself as a social climber I will always be worrying if people are using me for something (since I am using them!). If I identify with my wealth I might develop some neurosis regarding the sight of the homeless (since they represent ultimate failure!). I don't believe in reincarnation but it is a helpful thought experiment to think about what benefits and drawbacks your particular incarnation of life holds and how those might be different if you were incarnated elsewhere.

mcguire 5y ago
That's interesting and well-put! I've thought for a long time that the world is, in a sense, a mirror: what you see out there is a reflection of yourself. A social climber worrying about being used is a part of that I hadn't considered before.
- scns 5y ago
  In psychology it is called projection.
- dQw4w9WgXcQ 5y ago
  There's many degrees of accuracy for truth that have nothing to do with ourselves. What you see and experience generally can reach a high level of accuracy -> "He is already an L6 by 30." It is the motives and reasons behind events that are most subject to gap filling with our personal experiences "He must be climbing the corporate ladder." When the Bible (via Jesus) speaks about judging, it is referring to being cautious with assessing motives, not drawing conclusions about factual happenings.
SkipperCat 5y ago
So true. I read an article ago where they studied aging and they found that everything about a person degrades, eyesight, strength, cognition, etc with the exception of impulse control and patience. As you age, you mellow out and are less tethered to knee jerk reactions. For me, as someone approaching 'early geezerdom', I see it in my work interactions. What used to bother me, I can now let pass.
- scns 5y ago
  This progress can be be sped up with meditation.
  - datameta 5y ago
    Sans side-effects of aging, of course.
foobiekr 5y ago
I've had this experience myself. Actually, your description is so much kinder than mine that I think I will adopt it. What I have said up until now is that as I've gotten older, my emotional level has declined very substantially, especially in the last ten years. It's like the volume got turned down. Very few things bother me, and very few things excite me. I'd associated it until now with a sort of depersonalization but instead I will identify as just being the thing that passes through different states of being. They're kind of the same thing, but I'd feel less weird saying it the way you did.
- only_as_i_fall 5y ago
  You could just be depressed
- packetlost 5y ago
  That's me, except I'm in my early-mid 20s and I've always been like that. I describe it as being 'the opposite of neurotic' in a psychological sense.
  - dennis_jeeves 5y ago
    You are way ahead of the crowd, take care.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- scns 5y ago
  Aristoteles wrote this is the goal IIRC. In buddhism they aim for something similar, neither being swayed by your desires nor fears, stay calm enables being able to act instead only reacting to external stimuli on autopilot. Nothing wrong with it IMSO.
  - jetrink 5y ago
    > IMSO In my stoic opinion?
minikites 5y ago
Your comment is very well put and reminds me of this quote from Boethius: >It's my belief that history is a wheel. "Inconsistency is my very essence" -says the wheel- "Rise up on my spokes if you like, but don't complain when you are cast back down into the depths. Good times pass away, but then so do the bad. Mutability is our tragedy, but it is also our hope. The worst of times, like the best, are always passing away".
BurningFrog 5y ago
This is a common development for men as we get older. I could write something similar. I'd like to think I'm maturing and becoming wise. But I suspect it's really the falling testosterone levels that come with age...
- moneywoes 5y ago
  Have you considered supplementation
annamargot 5y ago
Self-awareness is how I look at it. And it is finally taking hold with age :) I can better manage my emotions by simply being able to recognize them almost from an outsider’s perspective. My inner monologue switches to 3rd person “Yeah you’re feeling super irritable right now, you better go chill out somewhere before you say something you don’t mean and then create a whole big thing for no reason” Younger me would have started some shit and created unnecessary problems
- jasonladuke0311 5y ago
  This is similar to how I approach cognitive biases; I cannot prevent them, as they are innate to human nature. But I posit that if I try to make myself aware of the influence of bias, it might be more managable/less impactful when it affects me.
gexla 5y ago
Right, I work to keep my identity small and to be adaptable. Making things "always about you" is seeing the world through that identity tainted lens and positioning the world as if you are the center. I instead try to be observational and LARP into any situation as if I'm in an improv show.
TedDoesntTalk 5y ago
Whatever has the nature to arise will also pass away.
maybevain 5y ago
Aside, but for those like me who can't help but wonder: EBT (I believe) stands for electronic benefit transfer, apparently an electronic payment method issued by welfare departments in the USA.
- MandieD 5y ago
  Yes - it is the successor of food stamps. Every time I’m back home and see someone ahead of me paying with it, I say a prayer of thanks that I’ve never had to make do with it and another prayer that I never will.
roystonvassey 5y ago
"What we are angry about tends to be a reflection of ourselves more than the current state of affairs." Absolutely. It is definitely hard to cut through all the fluff when we are emotional but this realization has helped me so many times and, this applies not just at work. Just as we are going through these states and the self-awareness is important, it helps to also realize that others are transiting too through these different states. I'm reminded of an another thought that was shared here a while back that I try to remember often: “Life is mostly froth and bubble, Two things stand like stone. Kindness in another's trouble, Courage in your own.” ― Adam Lindsay Gordon
aomobile 5y ago
I think the homeless don’t scare people necessarily because they are a what-might-be but rather because of being a what-is. In the us you might get a bad conscience if you see a homeless person but hey at least your salary is good. In Europe we pay so many taxes that it feels a bit different.
- OneTimePetes 5y ago
  In europe i feel anger on the state whos employees failed to rectify a situation i paid and worked hard so nobody has to experience it.
V-2 5y ago
"As I get older, the less I identify as my current state and the more I identify with the person who transitions through states." This sounds neat, but once you set the states aside - what's left? :) Who's that person? Our identity is a sum of these states. The rest (navigating through states) is an illusion. Just like movement in a video is an illusion created by consecutive frames. The sense of continuity is a magic trick. I could agree that some (perhaps most, who knows) self-identifications are unnecessary and burdening, toxic even. And possibly cost more than the value they bring into our life, especially since we tend to cling on to them for too long. "This too shall pass", if meant as a universal motto, isn't an attitude that would inevitably stem from this observation, though (in my view). Say, being a parent is also a phase, in a way, it's just a state of my life and personhood. Not the essence of myself. But I do care about my son nevertheless. This makes me more vulnerable and potentially frustrated, but well, that's what constitutes being a person. "What we are angry about tends to be a reflection of ourselves more than the current state of affairs" That's no different from what we're happy about, etc. Without personhood all is just an enormous cloud of elementary particles floating in the dark
- dr_dshiv 5y ago
  > Without personhood all is just an enormous cloud of elementary particles floating in the dark I don't understand. Dropping personhood and ego doesn't mean dropping feeling, wisdom or meaning. In fact, it is precisely when the ego is dissolved that we can feel most meaningfully connected to ultimate reality. Our personhood is not what makes raw matter ("elementary particles floating in the dark") vibrant, alive and coherent. Personhood is a very useful social-cognitive illusion but, when dropped, the world tends to become richer not more empty. Nah?
  - loopz 5y ago
    Your understanding is ultimately for you, an illusion, but also a convenient and necessary part of life.
  - momirlan 5y ago
    Totally agree.

by zwkrt 5y ago

mcguire 5y ago

That's interesting and well-put! I've thought for a long time that the world is, in a sense, a mirror: what you see out there is a reflection of yourself. A social climber worrying about being used is a part of that I hadn't considered before.

scns 5y ago
In psychology it is called projection.
dQw4w9WgXcQ 5y ago
There's many degrees of accuracy for truth that have nothing to do with ourselves. What you see and experience generally can reach a high level of accuracy -> "He is already an L6 by 30." It is the motives and reasons behind events that are most subject to gap filling with our personal experiences "He must be climbing the corporate ladder." When the Bible (via Jesus) speaks about judging, it is referring to being cautious with assessing motives, not drawing conclusions about factual happenings.

SkipperCat 5y ago

So true. I read an article ago where they studied aging and they found that everything about a person degrades, eyesight, strength, cognition, etc with the exception of impulse control and patience. As you age, you mellow out and are less tethered to knee jerk reactions. For me, as someone approaching 'early geezerdom', I see it in my work interactions. What used to bother me, I can now let pass.

scns 5y ago
This progress can be be sped up with meditation.
- datameta 5y ago
  Sans side-effects of aging, of course.

foobiekr 5y ago

I've had this experience myself. Actually, your description is so much kinder than mine that I think I will adopt it. What I have said up until now is that as I've gotten older, my emotional level has declined very substantially, especially in the last ten years. It's like the volume got turned down. Very few things bother me, and very few things excite me. I'd associated it until now with a sort of depersonalization but instead I will identify as just being the thing that passes through different states of being. They're kind of the same thing, but I'd feel less weird saying it the way you did.

only_as_i_fall 5y ago
You could just be depressed
packetlost 5y ago
That's me, except I'm in my early-mid 20s and I've always been like that. I describe it as being 'the opposite of neurotic' in a psychological sense.
- dennis_jeeves 5y ago
  You are way ahead of the crowd, take care.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
scns 5y ago
Aristoteles wrote this is the goal IIRC. In buddhism they aim for something similar, neither being swayed by your desires nor fears, stay calm enables being able to act instead only reacting to external stimuli on autopilot. Nothing wrong with it IMSO.
- jetrink 5y ago
  > IMSO In my stoic opinion?

minikites 5y ago

Your comment is very well put and reminds me of this quote from Boethius: >It's my belief that history is a wheel. "Inconsistency is my very essence" -says the wheel- "Rise up on my spokes if you like, but don't complain when you are cast back down into the depths. Good times pass away, but then so do the bad. Mutability is our tragedy, but it is also our hope. The worst of times, like the best, are always passing away".

BurningFrog 5y ago

This is a common development for men as we get older. I could write something similar. I'd like to think I'm maturing and becoming wise. But I suspect it's really the falling testosterone levels that come with age...

moneywoes 5y ago
Have you considered supplementation

annamargot 5y ago

Self-awareness is how I look at it. And it is finally taking hold with age :) I can better manage my emotions by simply being able to recognize them almost from an outsider’s perspective. My inner monologue switches to 3rd person “Yeah you’re feeling super irritable right now, you better go chill out somewhere before you say something you don’t mean and then create a whole big thing for no reason” Younger me would have started some shit and created unnecessary problems

jasonladuke0311 5y ago
This is similar to how I approach cognitive biases; I cannot prevent them, as they are innate to human nature. But I posit that if I try to make myself aware of the influence of bias, it might be more managable/less impactful when it affects me.

gexla 5y ago

Right, I work to keep my identity small and to be adaptable. Making things "always about you" is seeing the world through that identity tainted lens and positioning the world as if you are the center. I instead try to be observational and LARP into any situation as if I'm in an improv show.

TedDoesntTalk 5y ago

Whatever has the nature to arise will also pass away.

maybevain 5y ago

Aside, but for those like me who can't help but wonder: EBT (I believe) stands for electronic benefit transfer, apparently an electronic payment method issued by welfare departments in the USA.

MandieD 5y ago
Yes - it is the successor of food stamps. Every time I’m back home and see someone ahead of me paying with it, I say a prayer of thanks that I’ve never had to make do with it and another prayer that I never will.

roystonvassey 5y ago

"What we are angry about tends to be a reflection of ourselves more than the current state of affairs." Absolutely. It is definitely hard to cut through all the fluff when we are emotional but this realization has helped me so many times and, this applies not just at work. Just as we are going through these states and the self-awareness is important, it helps to also realize that others are transiting too through these different states. I'm reminded of an another thought that was shared here a while back that I try to remember often: “Life is mostly froth and bubble, Two things stand like stone. Kindness in another's trouble, Courage in your own.” ― Adam Lindsay Gordon

aomobile 5y ago

I think the homeless don’t scare people necessarily because they are a what-might-be but rather because of being a what-is. In the us you might get a bad conscience if you see a homeless person but hey at least your salary is good. In Europe we pay so many taxes that it feels a bit different.

OneTimePetes 5y ago
In europe i feel anger on the state whos employees failed to rectify a situation i paid and worked hard so nobody has to experience it.

V-2 5y ago

"As I get older, the less I identify as my current state and the more I identify with the person who transitions through states." This sounds neat, but once you set the states aside - what's left? :) Who's that person? Our identity is a sum of these states. The rest (navigating through states) is an illusion. Just like movement in a video is an illusion created by consecutive frames. The sense of continuity is a magic trick. I could agree that some (perhaps most, who knows) self-identifications are unnecessary and burdening, toxic even. And possibly cost more than the value they bring into our life, especially since we tend to cling on to them for too long. "This too shall pass", if meant as a universal motto, isn't an attitude that would inevitably stem from this observation, though (in my view). Say, being a parent is also a phase, in a way, it's just a state of my life and personhood. Not the essence of myself. But I do care about my son nevertheless. This makes me more vulnerable and potentially frustrated, but well, that's what constitutes being a person. "What we are angry about tends to be a reflection of ourselves more than the current state of affairs" That's no different from what we're happy about, etc. Without personhood all is just an enormous cloud of elementary particles floating in the dark

dr_dshiv 5y ago
> Without personhood all is just an enormous cloud of elementary particles floating in the dark I don't understand. Dropping personhood and ego doesn't mean dropping feeling, wisdom or meaning. In fact, it is precisely when the ego is dissolved that we can feel most meaningfully connected to ultimate reality. Our personhood is not what makes raw matter ("elementary particles floating in the dark") vibrant, alive and coherent. Personhood is a very useful social-cognitive illusion but, when dropped, the world tends to become richer not more empty. Nah?
- loopz 5y ago
  Your understanding is ultimately for you, an illusion, but also a convenient and necessary part of life.
- momirlan 5y ago
  Totally agree.