5 ms·

How does one know if their clothing is PFAS-free if it doesn't specifically say?

by hmm320 5y ago

chamsom 5y ago
If your clothing is waterproof or has some kind of exercise "moisture wicking" material, it is common to have PFAS.
- strict9 5y ago
  An absurd challenge: walk to into a target or some other large retail store and try to find mens briefs that do not have moisture wicking treatment. It feels like I'm in a strange dystopia trying to find undergarments not treated with some sort of PFAS additives.
  - AlgorithmicTime 5y ago
    I don't think PFAS are for moisture wicking. More water/moisture repelling. Also, go to Costco and there's a 3 or 4 pack of 100% cotton boxer-briefs on sale.
  - dd36 5y ago
    Me too but for undershirts! I didn’t see your comment before making mine.
  - ashildr 5y ago
    This is really strange - I’m in Germany and I hear for the first time that underwear is treated like this. None of the brand I wear (HOM) seem to be and I don’t remember that being mentioned on any pack of underwear I purchased the last 40 years. Is it an US thing? (and yes, I’m posting about my underwear on hacker news. weird.)
    - strict9 5y ago
      It is strange! It's a recent thing in the US, yes. Probably in the past 4-5 years nearly all major brands put some sort of special chemical that gives it 'moisture wicking' (usually in partnership with Dow or 3M).
      - ashildr 5y ago
        Maybe it’s only in sports apparel over here?
      - ectopod 5y ago
        I just bought some new underwear from Marks & Spencer in the UK which has their "Cool & Fresh" treatment. I haven't worn it yet but this thread is putting me off. M&S publish a Manufacturing Restricted Substances List [1] for their suppliers, which seems to ban the use of all per- and poly-fluorinated chemicals in the manufacture of textiles for them. Either I'm misunderstanding, or some of these underwear treatments don't involve PFAs. Who knows what they use instead? [1]: https://corporate.marksandspencer.com/documents/plan-a-our-approach/ecp-modules-2020/mns-ecp-mrsl-and-rsl.pdf https://corporate.marksandspencer.com/documents/plan-a-our-a...
- nate_meurer 5y ago
  Wicking materials don't use PFAS (although see edit below). The properties that PFAS endows a fabric are pretty much of the opposite of what you need for wicking. Wicking fabrics such as Capilene and polypropylene must be wettable in order to work. PFAS reduces the wettability of fibers. That's its whole point. PFAS is used in nearly all current water resistant fabrics, including clothing, upholstery, and carpet. The industry calls these Durable Water Resistant (DWR) treatments. PFAS-free treatments are only just recently hitting the market, but there are only a few so far and they're expensive. The North Face's Futurlight, Helly Hanson's Lifa are the only ones I know by name, but I've heard that Marmot and Mountain Hardware have some PFC-free garments as well. EDIT: I searched "PFAS wicking" and I see a some underwear makers are claiming their DWR treated products have enhanced wicking properties. This is confusing marketing. The DWR isn't actually enhacing the wicking. Rather, it's keeping the surface of the fabric that's next to the skin dry, while the untreated bulk of the fabric wicks moisture away. This is sort of like the thin perforated polyethylene membrane used in Band Aids to keep the would dry and prevent adhesion of the dressing. Nevertheless, it appears we now have to be wary of forever chemicals in our underwear. Lame.
  - colechristensen 5y ago
    Waxed canvas is also waterproof and free of questionable chemistry and is delightful.
    - nate_meurer 5y ago
      I agree. My favorite hat is oilcloth, and it's as waterproof as any fancy modern gear.
  - meristohm 5y ago
    I’ve put off buying a sleeping bag from REI because of DWR. I like to sleep outside as much as I can, and when temps are freezing a well-insulated bag is great. I’ve switched to wool blankets for now. I’m also more and more okay with going without various comforts; the cost of having whatever I want is too high.
- dd36 5y ago
  I tried to buy new Hanes or Fruit of the Loom undershirts and literally couldn’t find any that didn’t have their proprietary coating.
  - loudtieblahblah 5y ago
    sigh. that's all the undershirts i have. i'm "sure" (/s) that the chinese competitors on amazon are sooo much better. I'm so tired of having to anaylze every fucking product i bring into my home and expose myself, my wife and my kid to. I'm tired of being "that guy" to my wife too. It's endlessly frustrating
    - dd36 5y ago
      Yes! Let’s start an underwear company!

How does one know if their clothing is PFAS-free if it doesn't specifically say?

by hmm320 5y ago

How does one know if their clothing is PFAS-free if it doesn't specifically say?

chamsom 5y ago

If your clothing is waterproof or has some kind of exercise "moisture wicking" material, it is common to have PFAS.

strict9 5y ago
An absurd challenge: walk to into a target or some other large retail store and try to find mens briefs that do not have moisture wicking treatment. It feels like I'm in a strange dystopia trying to find undergarments not treated with some sort of PFAS additives.
- AlgorithmicTime 5y ago
  I don't think PFAS are for moisture wicking. More water/moisture repelling. Also, go to Costco and there's a 3 or 4 pack of 100% cotton boxer-briefs on sale.
- dd36 5y ago
  Me too but for undershirts! I didn’t see your comment before making mine.
- ashildr 5y ago
  This is really strange - I’m in Germany and I hear for the first time that underwear is treated like this. None of the brand I wear (HOM) seem to be and I don’t remember that being mentioned on any pack of underwear I purchased the last 40 years. Is it an US thing? (and yes, I’m posting about my underwear on hacker news. weird.)
  - strict9 5y ago
    It is strange! It's a recent thing in the US, yes. Probably in the past 4-5 years nearly all major brands put some sort of special chemical that gives it 'moisture wicking' (usually in partnership with Dow or 3M).
    - ashildr 5y ago
      Maybe it’s only in sports apparel over here?
    - ectopod 5y ago
      I just bought some new underwear from Marks & Spencer in the UK which has their "Cool & Fresh" treatment. I haven't worn it yet but this thread is putting me off. M&S publish a Manufacturing Restricted Substances List [1] for their suppliers, which seems to ban the use of all per- and poly-fluorinated chemicals in the manufacture of textiles for them. Either I'm misunderstanding, or some of these underwear treatments don't involve PFAs. Who knows what they use instead? [1]: https://corporate.marksandspencer.com/documents/plan-a-our-approach/ecp-modules-2020/mns-ecp-mrsl-and-rsl.pdf https://corporate.marksandspencer.com/documents/plan-a-our-a...
nate_meurer 5y ago
Wicking materials don't use PFAS (although see edit below). The properties that PFAS endows a fabric are pretty much of the opposite of what you need for wicking. Wicking fabrics such as Capilene and polypropylene must be wettable in order to work. PFAS reduces the wettability of fibers. That's its whole point. PFAS is used in nearly all current water resistant fabrics, including clothing, upholstery, and carpet. The industry calls these Durable Water Resistant (DWR) treatments. PFAS-free treatments are only just recently hitting the market, but there are only a few so far and they're expensive. The North Face's Futurlight, Helly Hanson's Lifa are the only ones I know by name, but I've heard that Marmot and Mountain Hardware have some PFC-free garments as well. EDIT: I searched "PFAS wicking" and I see a some underwear makers are claiming their DWR treated products have enhanced wicking properties. This is confusing marketing. The DWR isn't actually enhacing the wicking. Rather, it's keeping the surface of the fabric that's next to the skin dry, while the untreated bulk of the fabric wicks moisture away. This is sort of like the thin perforated polyethylene membrane used in Band Aids to keep the would dry and prevent adhesion of the dressing. Nevertheless, it appears we now have to be wary of forever chemicals in our underwear. Lame.
- colechristensen 5y ago
  Waxed canvas is also waterproof and free of questionable chemistry and is delightful.
  - nate_meurer 5y ago
    I agree. My favorite hat is oilcloth, and it's as waterproof as any fancy modern gear.
- meristohm 5y ago
  I’ve put off buying a sleeping bag from REI because of DWR. I like to sleep outside as much as I can, and when temps are freezing a well-insulated bag is great. I’ve switched to wool blankets for now. I’m also more and more okay with going without various comforts; the cost of having whatever I want is too high.
dd36 5y ago
I tried to buy new Hanes or Fruit of the Loom undershirts and literally couldn’t find any that didn’t have their proprietary coating.
- loudtieblahblah 5y ago
  sigh. that's all the undershirts i have. i'm "sure" (/s) that the chinese competitors on amazon are sooo much better. I'm so tired of having to anaylze every fucking product i bring into my home and expose myself, my wife and my kid to. I'm tired of being "that guy" to my wife too. It's endlessly frustrating
  - dd36 5y ago
    Yes! Let’s start an underwear company!